>> If you were given 500,000 -- $500 a month with no strings attached what would you spend it on? That is what researchers in Stockton want to know and it is an experiment that select fun but at the same time it is getting to the heart of a major problem. What to do when the economy is booming at some people are still living in poverty? Can you solve it by giving everyone a universal basic income? Starting next year pilot program in Stockton will give 100 people, $500 a month as part of a basic income study. Stockton mayor Michael Tubbs and working with private donors to secure funding for the 18 month project and he believes the monthly $500 checks will help people. >> Utility expenses, average of like trash, Jersey, water and Internet for a lot of families is around $500. With that we think we will be able to show effects of just that being not enough to replace work, but enough to provide financial floor for people. >> Joining me to discuss this pilot project in Stockton and the concept of universal basic income is Matt Zwolinski, professor of philosophy at the University of San Diego and founder of USD center for ethics and economic policy. Thank you for joining us. >> Great to be here. >> This program not using any text dollars. All private money and donations, right? But some cities and even whole countries have actually taken up this idea before, right? >> Nobody has implemented a full-scale basic income program as of yet. There are similar programs that involve cash transfers. And there are a lot of pilot programs small-scale programs that are testing the idea of a basic income. But all of them are on a relatively small scale so far. >> Where in the country so far? >> Right now we have programs in Stockton is we're talking about today. There is another program in Oakland that is being sponsored by the private venture capital group my company to. There is also the Alaska permanent fund which is not a new program, but it is the same kind of idea, right? That people are getting the cash grant, it is universal and everybody gets it and you get it whether you're working or not and is not means tested so does not depend on what your level of income is. We can gather a lot of data of how people respond to the kind of think that a basic income would do but looking at how people have responded to permanent funding in similar program. >> Is 100 people, all different income levels, right? We have any idea how they might spend the money? >> We have some idea from previous cash transfer programs. Both in the United States and elsewhere in the world. One of the worries the people have about a basic income is if you give people cash money with no strings attached, they will just blow it, spend it on alcohol, drugs or gambling. We do have a fairly large body of liable desperate reliable evidence that that is not the case and the people giving cash transfers tend to spend the money on meeting their basic needs. They pay the rent, they paid maybe an overdue electric bill. They buy groceries with it. You do not see large increases in spending on what we call vices.'s but what about the fear that people [Indiscernible - low volume] perhaps not in San Diego but other places might take this money and stop working? >> Very common fear about basic income programs. And it is not entirely unfounded. If you give most people the choice between getting money for doing something and getting money for doing nothing, they will choose getting money for doing nothing. However most of the data we have from previous basic income experience suggests that the level of increased unemployment due to the implementation of a basic income is fairly low so if you look over the course over an entire year for instance, what you get is a reduction in labor time on the order of a couple of weeks. And was Stockton's program, again $500 a month, that is not enough to live on so nobody will really drop out of the labor force altogether. Because this program goes into effect. There are legitimate questions though about how things are going to work when you scale up. So these are short-term programs, right? Programs that run for 12-18 months if I tell you I will give you money, for 12 months, you will not quit your job but if I tell you I will give you money for the rest of your life, that might have a very different effect. >> Good point and have to ask how might this affect things like benefits like food stamps? With a be reduced? But it depends on the way in which the program is implemented so a lot of different models about how a basic income would work. Stockton's program is a benefit that is been audit on top of existing social welfare program so they get everything they are already getting plus basic income. If you try to scale that up and do that on a national level, even statewide level, that could get very, very expensive very quick so most models propose placing certain forms of existing social where for programs with a basic income so you might say and food stamps and simply give people cash instead. >> How could universal basic income affect unemployment? >> One argument is that a basic income if it replaces existing conditional transfer programs could actually reduce unemployment because with existing programs, I love times you lose your benefit if you work too much. Basic income because it is unconditional, does not have that problem associated with it so if you will swap out existing programs and replace those with a basic income, you could eliminate that work incentive and possibly see a net increase in employment. >> In a country like the United States, herbalism and survival of the fittest kind of a core value, how much support concert like this have? >> Depends on who you ask but there are certainly a lot of resistance to the idea of basic income from across the political spent some really so on the right spectrum really so on the right undermining the work ethic and giving people something for nothing and encouraging kind of laziness. On the left, you have some opposition to the basic income as well mostly from people who fear that it will undermine the traditional social safety net which they believe is better suited to meeting people's actual needs that the way to alleviate poverty in the United States is not just to get people cash but target needs for the people medical treatment or substance abuse programs. >> Thank you for filling us in. >> Thank you a pleasure. >> That is Matt Zwolinski, Professor at USD.
A basic income pilot is starting soon in Stockton which will give 100 people $500 per month for 18 months. The program is not using any public money. Instead it is being funded with private donations.
The people will be randomly selected and income levels will vary. Researchers are hoping to see what people do with the money each month.
University of San Diego Professor of Philosophy Matt Zwolinski will explain the idea behind basic income and if it can be expanded Thursday on Midday Edition.
