Navy Secretary Out Over Navy SEAL Gallagher Case, Paradise Hills Shooting Highlights Domestic Violence Danger, Tips To Reduce Food Waste On Thanksgiving And More

Speaker 1: 00:00 The secretary of the Navy is fired over the Gallagher case. A nine year old boy shot alongside his family and paradise Hills has died. I'm Jade Hindman. I'm Maureen Kavanaugh. This is KPBS midday edition. It's Monday, November 25th Speaker 2: 00:26 in a letter to president Trump fired Navy secretary Richard Spencer writes, quote, I no longer share the same understanding with the commander in chief who appointed me. I cannot in good conscience obey an order that I believe violates the sacred oath. I took unquote. That was Spencer's response to the president's most recent intervention in the case of Navy seal chief Edward Gallagher, the Gallagher case has already led to a review of the Navy's military justice system and now the firing of the secretary of the Navy journey me is KPBS military reporter Steve Walsh, who's been covering this case from the beginning. And Steve, welcome back. Hi Maureen, can you explain the order that secretary Richard Spencer says he cannot obey? What did the president want the Navy to do? Speaker 3: 01:14 Well, that that is the question here. What, what was the actual order we're talking about? But I really need to take a step back and just say, you know, this has been a giant soap opera, let's call it as the Trident turns here. You remember way back when this began back at the beginning of the year, Trump intervened to try to remove Gallagher from the brig. He talked to pardoning him pretrial and Memorial day. Some outcry came from conservative, so he let the process play out and then during the trial, seven seals testify against him. Uh, but he's acquitted to the most serious charges on the stand. Corey Scott says he killed the detainee himself by closing off his breathing tube, not Gallagher. Uh, he was convicted of this one charge posing with the corpse. The CNO came back and upheld his demotion, which was part of the original sentence. And then there came these reports more recently that Trump wanted to restore a Gallagher to chief secretary of defense. Speaker 3: 02:13 Mark Esper meets with Trump trying to convince him not to intervene in this case, that it would happen to impact on good order and discipline in the military. Trump restores the rank anyway. Then the head of Naval special warfare, Admiral Collin rear Admiral Colin green announces that this Trident review board to remove Gallagher from the Navy seals and late Friday there's reports that the secretary of Navy, Richard Spencer is he's going to resign if Trump intervenes. Spencer then denies this publicly that he was trying to resign. Then on Sunday, Spencer is fired by the secretary of defense. Mark Esper saying green basically lied to him far from resigning. Spencer was actually trying to work out a deal with the white house to let Gallagher keep his Trident. So if that's the case doesn't exactly leave a hero. Spencer on the other hand indicates that in his own letter that I cannot in good conscience obey in order that I believe violates the, that sacred oath that I took in the presence of my family, my flag, and my faith. Who is telling the truth? I don't. We're going to find out really soon I suppose, but it has been tremendous Solprop bruh. And it's changed Speaker 2: 03:26 almost every few hours. Can you explain the order that secretary Richard Spencer says he cannot obey? Watch of the president want the Navy to do the president wanted to do stop the Trident review board by Edinburgh, Colin green. How does the Trident review work? Speaker 3: 03:45 This is actually, um, Admiral Collin rear Admiral Collin green, the head of Naval special warfare. He's the one who, uh, ultimately is the ultimate authority in this. But there will be review of a couple of different off officers we've already know from talking to some of the attorneys involved in the case that they were asked to submit information in their own defense. But there, this is not like a court martial. They won't be going to trial. Um, they're simply going to have this review done by officers behind the scenes. Speaker 2: 04:15 And these are a Navy seal officers who would be doing this review. They wouldn't deed. And why is keeping your Triton such a big deal? I've had it described Speaker 3: 04:25 to me it's the equivalent of your pilot's wings. It's your essentially your, uh, your, your, um, authority to practice being a Navy seal. It is essentially you stay within the Navy, but you're kicked out of the, uh, uh, the seals themselves. Speaker 2: 04:42 Gallagher says the effort to review his Trident was all about the military brasses ego. Here he is on Fox news this weekend. Speaker 4: 04:50 It says nothing to do with good order and discipline. They could have taken my Trident at any anytime they wanted. Now they're trying to take it after the president restored my rank and after we just filed an IgG exposing all of the corruption that's been going on during my case all the way up to Admiral green. Um, and just recently we've come up with more evidence that we'll be exposing next week that the secretary of the Navy was actually meddling in my case and trying to get organizations not to support me while I was incarcerated. Speaker 2: 05:20 First of all, how does an active duty Navy seal talk about his case on a TV show? Speaker 3: 05:24 Well, Gallagher has been a special case this since this entire episode began. He's a, his brother and his wife have been routinely on conservative talk radio as well as on a Fox news guy, Gallagher for the most part. As this was going through the court process, he had a, he had not appeared himself. He's, he has been on a couple of different television shows, but mostly he's, he has stayed behind the scenes, uh, letting his family and his attorney Tim palpatory go on Fox news to make his case, knowing that the president watches news and that they don't even have to work behind the scenes. His attorney told me he, they know they have the presidency or Speaker 1: 06:04 now former Navy secretary Spencer says in his letter that he's out because he can't obey the president's order. But there's confusion about this because the secretary of defense says it's about a back room deal. What, what is that argument? Speaker 3: 06:20 Well, secretary of defense, Mark Esper has said that to his face. Um, secretary of the Navy, uh, Richard Spencer had told him that he supported, uh, the notion of the Trident review board going forward. Turns out, according to Mark Esper that Spencer was working directly with the white house to work out a, uh, a deal to allow Gallagher to keep this Trident. Speaker 1: 06:44 I've been speaking with KPBS military reporter Steve wall. Steve, thank you very much, right? Speaker 5: 06:54 [inaudible] Speaker 1: 06:57 a nine year old boy who was shot alongside his family recently in paradise Hills has died two weeks ago. Police say his mother had received a restraining order against her estranged husband, but before the order was served, investigators say Jose Valdivia went to their home and shot her, therefore children and then himself court documents reveal Valdivia started to harass and even make homicidal threats to his wife after she filed for divorce and the couple separated. So was there something that could have been done to prevent such a tragedy? Jessica Jafaro, outgoing president of the San Diego domestic violence council joins us. Jessica, welcome. Speaker 6: 07:37 Thanks so much. Speaker 1: 07:39 Court documents give us a window into how this tragedy unfolded. As president of the San Diego domestic violence council, do you see any areas of the process to file a restraining order that could be improved to prevent something like this from happening? Again, Speaker 6: 07:53 it feels to me like there are a couple of areas that we have the opportunity to improve in and to provide education around. First and foremost being that we know statistically speaking that upon filing a restraining order and in preparation to leave a relationship where there has been any form of domestic clients is actually the most dangerous time for a survivor and their children. And so one of the things that we talk about often and want to ensure that our community is aware of is in fact that association, not to preclude someone from leaving, but ensuring that they understand the dangers associated so that those of us who are prepared to provide the resources and work through safety plans are able to offer access to those that are, that are getting ready to leave or have just filed a restraining order to ensure that we're mitigating the risk of any danger. Speaker 1: 08:47 And as you mentioned, that time period right before and right after a restraining order has been filed, are most dangerous for a victim of domestic violence. Can you tell me more about that? Speaker 6: 08:56 Absolutely. We know that domestic violence is all about power and control and in that power and control dynamic, what we also know to be true is that when a harm doer or perpetrator feels like they're losing control, they will go to any length to regain that control. Which is why we see the incidents of violence escalate and why we often see that a harm Dewar or a perpetrator is going to link that they haven't before when in fact they feel like they're at risk of losing their partner and or family. Speaker 1: 09:26 You mentioned safety plans. What do those look like and who plans them? Speaker 6: 09:31 Really good question. So we really like to emphasize that a survivor is the expert in their relationship. And so we really want to acknowledge that because the safety plan is not something that we do for them. It's something that we are able to do with them asking that they provide feedback and input information around how is it that they've been able to keep themselves safe thus far. What do they know about the existence of weapons in the home? Um, one of the things that, that, um, we've talked quite a bit about in our field of practice around this tragedy is the idea that when we're talking with survivors about the preparation to leave, whether there is a restraining order being filed or not, that that is there's an opportunity there to talk about things like what an emergency shelter even temporarily be important to consider. Speaker 6: 10:23 Is there an extended family member or friends that maybe the perpetrator or harm Duer doesn't have access to? And could you stay there as things begin to feel more volatile and escalate? And so the fact that, um, the, the victim in this case alluded to the fact that there had been an escalation in violent behavior and that there was fear around her safety and the safety of her children. There may have been an opportunity there to have had conversation around how to well protect her and the kids in ways that that may not have been discussed. Speaker 1: 11:02 No police said, um, this week that Valdivia had not been served with the restraining order, meaning uh, it was not in effect when he went to the home on Saturday and want to focus in on that time period a little bit between when an order is signed by a judge and when that order is served to someone. Is there a standard of time where that order has to be served? Speaker 6: 11:24 The standard of time is, is basically as soon as possible. What I, what I'm not clear about and I don't want to miss speak on is at what point it is deemed to be in effect if a perpetrator has not been found, there is a period of time where if in fact there have been a number of attempts made to serve an individual and they have been avoiding avoiding the restraining order being served. Um, there is a period of time in which it is considered to be in effect, even if that service hasn't been able to occur. Speaker 1: 11:59 What options do victims of domestic violence have to ensure their safety? Speaker 6: 12:03 San Diego County has a number of really incredible resources available that span from things like protection of immigration status to short term and longterm shelter options that include transitional housing. We also offer things like bus passes, free legal resources, counseling services for survivors and their children as well as counseling services for harm doers or perpetrators. Many of our agencies offer support with things like rental deposit and helping, um, a survivor and his or her children start over, uh, in a new location if, if necessary. Victims of crime as a phenomenal resource that, um, AIDS those who have criminal cases either pending or having been acted on, uh, that can help with relocation services, um, ensuring witness protection, those sorts of things. And so the access to resources, I should say is plentiful. What we really want to be working on is knowledge around those resources. Speaker 1: 13:06 I've been speaking with Jessica Jada, the outgoing president of the San Diego domestic violence council. Jessica, thank you so much for joining us. Speaker 6: 13:15 Thanks so much for having me. Speaker 1: 13:28 An ambitious effort to boost the number and size of trees in the city of San Diego faces a difficult time table. KPBS reporter Eric Anderson says the city's climate action plan hopes to soften the impact of climate change by tripling the city's tree canopy. Speaker 7: 13:46 Okay. Until now. Speaker 8: 13:50 Landscaper Narcissa Gonzalez unwinds the hose attached to a tank in the back of his white pickup truck. He's in this mid city neighborhood to water dozens of young trees planted here three years ago. Speaker 7: 14:00 Okay, I'm going to water these bags. I keep it the water for a light system like drip, Speaker 8: 14:05 the hose goes into the green bag, wrapped around the base of the tree. That bag can be filled in minutes, but it takes hours to drain and allows the fledgling tree a chance to soak up the water before it runs off. Consols delivered water every week. The first year after trees were planted here Speaker 7: 14:24 on the second year, uh, twice a month. And this year is a once a month. Speaker 8: 14:30 He does make extra stops during the hottest part of the year. These young trees are part of a Cal fire grant or the city of San Diego. I'll welcome present for the city's official Forester. Brian Wood. Nah, he's in charge of managing the city's urban forest and he says more new trees are on the way. We're planning to put in about 1100 Speaker 9: 14:52 street trees this calendar year. And then in addition to that, up to 400 additional trees and park locations. Speaker 8: 14:59 The young trees are an important step toward broadening the urban tree canopy, but wouldn't our says success won't be reached by adding just small new trees. He also wants to see existing trees get bigger, Speaker 9: 15:12 protect them, maintain them better. Um, we did some analysis of our tree canopy cover back in 2015 so we know what areas of the city might need additional tree planting or additional tree maintenance in order to help us get to that Speaker 8: 15:31 would an hour has the daunting task of tripling the city's tree canopy in just over a decade. That's important because trees pull carbon out of the air, they cool the urban landscape and they filter pollution. Trees are also a significant part of the city's plan to reduce the impact of greenhouse gases. And that's why there's a push for more. Speaker 9: 15:52 They get from 13 to 35%. Yes, it's going to be very challenging. Um, I think that we could do it, but again, we have to be able to focus in on the resources that we think are important and able to get to that goal. Speaker 8: 16:05 So what does a 35% tree canopy look like? Oh, it looks a lot like Balboa park, which has more than 15,000 trees, but not every city neighborhood enjoys that same environmental benefit. So if he Wolf for him works with the climate action campaign, she's standing on university Avenue in city Heights. Speaker 10: 16:28 So down this way, um, we're looking toward the I 15, and you can see that there is, um, kind of a smattering of trees here and there. Um, and this is where we have the potential to invest in taking care of our existing canopy, which really needs to be the top priority. It's the fastest way to grow the urban canopy. Speaker 8: 16:52 The street has one of the city's busiest bus routes and she says it's a prime location for both more young trees and bigger older ones. She says using trees to cool this urban heat Island will benefit a community that already faces economic challenges and for him says the clock is ticking. Speaker 10: 17:13 You've got one year to up the tree canopy by 2% that's a huge feat. And then we have until 2035 to nearly triple the tree canopy or the urban forest in San Diego. So it's going to be a big topic. Speaker 8: 17:26 And she says the only way the city can keep up is to hire extra staff Speaker 10: 17:31 meeting any of our climate action plan targets is going to be a question of political will. We know that we have a roadmap, we have a way to get there, but we need to invest in staff resources and we need to make all of these strategies a priority. We can get there. We just have to say we're going to do it and we have to consistently invest. Speaker 8: 17:49 Wolfram says Speaker 2: 17:50 San Diego hasn't made that commitment yet, and she is sure those aggressive climate goals will be unattainable without it. Eric Anderson, KPBS news joining me is KPBS environment reporter Eric Anderson. Eric, welcome. My pleasure. What kinds of trees is the city planning? Speaker 8: 18:09 Well, the city's planning a number of different trees. Uh, it might even be, uh, easier to say what kind of trees aren't they planting, right? They're not planting any more eucalyptus trees. Uh, we know that those trees have issues when it comes to windy conditions or stormy conditions. Uh, and they're not, uh, focusing on planting any more Palm trees either because they don't provide the benefit that the city is looking for. It's that shade benefit. It's that broad canopy, uh, that contains all those environmental, uh, pluses that they're looking for. Speaker 2: 18:39 So let's talk about Palm trees for a minute because even though they're not planting any, we still have quite a few of them. And an assessment was made in the last few years that found that Southern California is Palm trees are not doing too well, that a lot of them are dying because of bug infestations. And fungus, is there going to be an effort to try to take care of these trees that we do have? Speaker 8: 19:00 It is in the sense that that what they want is existing trees to be bigger. Um, that will grow the canopy, right? There are two ways. You get a bigger canopy. You, you plant more trees and you make the existing trees that you have, uh, bigger. So yes, uh, you want to make sure that uh, bugs and beetles aren't destroying the existing trees that are out there, that, that create the canopy that the city currently has. Um, and so you want to address that at some point. But again, the focus is on, um, trying to grow that canopy, uh, in those two ways, which is planting new trees. Um, which if you drive around the city, you've probably seen these curbside, uh, trees, young saplings that have these green bags around the base of them. You've probably seen those in a number of different neighborhoods around the city where the city is trying to increase the number of trees. And then it's also trying to take care of the trees that exist. Make them larger, right? So if you have a, an old growth tree that's, uh, 60 feet around and you can make it 80 feet around that, that increases the canopy. Speaker 2: 20:03 Now remind us about what kind of climate benefits the city expects will result from more trees. Speaker 8: 20:10 Sure. There are a number of things that trees do. Uh, one of the obvious ones is they provide shade, right? It reduces the heat in the urban environment. If you reduce the heat in the urban environment, if you have a lot of trees, a planet close to buildings, you might be able to lower your costs for, for keeping those buildings. Cool. Because they're not as hot as they otherwise would have been. A trees are great filters. They pull pollution out of the air pollution from cars that are, that are going by, uh, they pull that pollution out of the air, uh, and they kind of sequester it there. They also are great carbon sinks, right? This is, uh, uh, important for, uh, the greenhouse gas effect because they pull in carbon dioxide and they keep that carbon and they release oxygen. And so it's a way to, to get some of that dangerous carbon, which heats up our climate out of the atmosphere where it's doing the damage. Speaker 2: 21:03 And how does the city select the areas where they plant these new trees? Speaker 8: 21:07 I think they're really open to where they plant them as long as they have the right of way to plant them. Right. They can't plant trees, uh, wherever they want to. There are private property rules. They can't just put a tree in somebody's yard, front or back. Uh, they have to find a place. So usually that's a place, uh, between a sidewalk and a street. There's, there might be a narrow median strip there. Sometimes the median strip is in the middle of the roads and sometimes the areas where they plant trees are in parks, which they control or on school properties, which are public property, which they have a measure of control over. So once they find where they can put these trees, uh, then they go ahead and do it there. Speaker 2: 21:47 And is it the city's obligation to maintain these trees as they grow and so forth? Or suppose they plant near a business is that therefore the business owner's responsibility, what Speaker 8: 21:59 they do is they commit to watering the tree early in its life for the first two, three, four years to make sure that that kind of grabs hold and then kind of takes off. And it's, I sense it's a shared responsibility there. There are some people that, you know, don't actually want trees planted near their properties, right? Uh, they're worried about tree roots that might get into their plumbing and mess things up and they would rather not have those trees there. And, and you know, the city tries to work with property owners that have those concerns. But what the city is looking for is like, look, and there is a free tree program that the city runs we can talk about in a second, but what they're saying is, look, w we'll plant the trees, we'll get them established and then, you know, we kind of want them to grow on their own trees. Speaker 8: 22:43 Uh, don't require a huge amount of maintenance once they're in the ground and established, uh, you know, they have a big root system that can draw water and they can, they can feed themselves and grow as they, as they normally would. What is the free tree program? Right? So the city of San Diego has a, a free tree program where if you're a homeowner and you have one of those median strips near nearest street where you could plant a tree, they ask you to reach out to the city. Um, there's a website where you can go to ask the city to come plant a tree for you. Um, you agree to water it for three years, and then there's no charge to the homeowner who, who gets that tree. Uh, the city's also in the process of working on a program that basically expands that to where the city will give you a tree that you can plant, say in your backyard or in a different place in your front yard as long as you make the commitment to watering it for three years so that it can become established. Uh, they will give you that tree for free. So they're doing some things to kind of encourage Speaker 1: 23:46 a private property owners to take advantage of the land that they have available to, to plant trees. I've been speaking with KPBS environment reporter Eric Anderson. Eric, thank you. You're welcome. Thank you. The San Diego humane society is rolling out a controversial new program. Instead of keeping cats in shelters to either be adopted or euthanized, they are releasing them back to the streets and part two of her series KPBS investigative reporter Claire Traeger. Sir looks at what impacts those cats have on the environment. Speaker 11: 24:20 Jim Pew peers into the marshy grass at the Formosa slew in point Loma. Speaker 12: 24:24 It's too far away, but there's a super cool bird on that wooden stump over there Speaker 11: 24:29 with his cargo pants and wide brimmed hat. He looks like exactly what you'd expect from the conservation chair at the San Diego Audubon society. I think it's a Phoebe. I'm not sure there were birds everywhere in the Marsh, but as we talked, we also saw something else. Oh, the cat sitting and watching the birds was one of many. We saw in the slew there a big problem. Pew says, Speaker 12: 24:58 you know, a typical house cat I guess catches avert a week. Speaker 11: 25:03 A 2013 study found outdoor cats are the biggest human caused threat to wildlife and kill between one and 4 billion birds each year in the U S despite these sobering facts, the San Diego humane society has allowed more than 1200 captured stray and feral cats to be released back into the wild since it took over animal control services for San Diego and several other cities in the County. It's a controversial practice that is angered many environmentalist and animal rights advocates and led to legal challenges in Los Angeles and orange counties. We should be treating cats like we treat dogs. Grant Sizemore is director of invasive species programs at the American bird Conservancy. He says, all cats should always be contained. Speaker 1: 25:54 We don't allow packs of wild dogs to run around this country anymore and we shouldn't allow hoards of to run around our parks or neighborhoods either. Speaker 11: 26:00 Sizemore and others. Point to research showing cats have caused the extinction of up to 63 species. They say euthanizing feral cats may be the only way to serve the greater good. Speaker 10: 26:13 50% of the cats in the United States are community cats who live outside Speaker 11: 26:17 such a policy would be completely unacceptable to people like Hannah Shah who is known as kitten lady. Speaker 10: 26:24 You know those cats don't deserve to die just because they were born outdoors and aren't social with humans. Speaker 11: 26:30 Her nonprofit, orphan kitten club traps feral cats and takes them to be spayed or neutered, then lets them go in a program called trap, neuter, release or TNR helps everyone. It helps the community. Speaker 10: 26:44 It helps the animal shelter. It helps kittens, you know, whether you like cats or don't like cats. TNR is for you. Speaker 11: 26:51 The point is to gradually decrease the feral cat population by preventing more cats from being born outdoors. But that doesn't swiftly deal with the problem the way bird lovers would like. Gary Weitzman, the CEO of the San Diego humane society is familiar with the arguments for why cats shouldn't be outside, but he says cats aren't actually the biggest threat to birds and other wild animals. And if cats do kill, that's part of nature. Speaker 13: 27:20 You know, I wish the nature was a little bit of a kinder, um, guardian of our planet than it is sometimes is. But the fact of the matter is we're committed to the welfare of both wild animals and domestic animals, and I don't think that those have to be mutually exclusive. Speaker 11: 27:36 And once they do wake up, we put them immediately into their trap. Meanwhile, Adri Stratton continues doing her work. She runs the feral cat coalition, which operates a small spay and neuter clinic in the college area because once they wake up, they're usually awake. Stratton stands over a table covered with sleeping cats at the moment. It's hard to see them as fierce hunters causing extinction of birds. They are cuddled up under blankets, but are actually Wildcats sleeping off their anesthesia. This is the only time they're getting pet, and if they knew what was happening, they wouldn't be happy about it. She hopes to expand her clinic. Right now, the work she does only makes a small dent in San Diego's stray cat population. Claire Trigere, sir KPBS news. Speaker 2: 28:35 Many of us are fortunate enough to have Thanksgiving dinners overflowing with main dishes, side dishes, snacks, desserts, all that food makes for a welcoming table, but it can also lead to a serious amount of food waste. And it's not just a problem at Thanksgiving. Food is the single largest item disposed of in landfills amounting to each person trashing an average of 20 pounds of food per month. Food waste is an environmental problem, a social problem, considering how many people face food insecurity and an economic problem costing families an average of $1,500 a year. So how do we stop it? Joining me is Ian Monaghan with, I love a clean San Diego and Ian, welcome to the program. Thank you for having me, Maureen. People might say, what's the problem with food in landfills? It's not like plastic. It decomposes. So what is the problem? Well, one of the things, I mean considering you know, one in seven people here in San Diego County or was facing food, food scarcity, you know, the season Speaker 14: 29:42 food waste is, is like you said, not only an environmental problem but it's a social problem. And the thing is when food goes to the landfill, um, it basically produces methane, which is a very powerful greenhouse gas. And, um, aside from costing folks money, um, it's also bad for the environment. Well, we've been able to reduce the overall amount of waste we put in landfills, but apparently not food. Why is that? Perhaps it's a matter of convenience. Before we came on here today, somebody sent me a world war era poster that basically spoke to what we're speaking about today. It's reducing, um, food waste. Um, it was a time of scarcity and people needed to buckle down and, and, and do the right thing, you know, but for, for us now, today we have so many options, um, for what we can consume. And in the season of getting creative around recipes and kicking off the holiday season, we can get just as creative in how we're going to reduce and divert food from the landfill. Speaker 14: 30:47 One of the ways that your organization has gotten a creative is that you're, you've come out with some tips on reducing the amount of food waste then winds up in the landfill during the holiday season. What's number one on the list? A great resource that we did find online is the guesstimate and, um, that is, uh, essentially a calculator that folks can use to go on a line in preparation for what they're going to plan for their meal and then basically see what amounts they're going to need for the various food types, for the number of people who are coming to their get together so that you don't overbuy to begin with. And that's a cost savings for you. And, uh, a savings for food waste as well. So it's not just how many pounds of Turkey should I buy for the, a number of gasps, but it's everything else. Speaker 14: 31:35 How many pounds of potatoes and so forth. Yeah, I mean, the, the, the overfilling plate of, of Thanksgiving dinner is, you know, synonymous with a feast and, uh, we've even found that doing sort of a buffet style Thanksgiving with smaller plates, people will come back for seconds if they want them, but not overload on food that they don't want from the or that they can't eat from the beginning. And you also say reducing meat dishes and increasing veggie dishes, uh, at our get togethers, it leads to less food waste. How does that work? Well, um, the UN had a very interesting report that came out in, in August and it covered a very broad range of things, but it found out that number one plant based diets are better for us. Um, number two, we can feed more people on plant-based and number three, plant-based dishes, reduce greenhouse gases. Speaker 14: 32:28 Um, now also, um, organic material can be composted and composting different from going into a landfill where it's an anaerobic process is an aerobic crosses so it doesn't produce methane. So, um, you know, and it can be preserved, um, just a longer in the refrigerator as well. Can you actually be more precise in the amount of produce and vegetables that you buy? Yes, I think, um, one of the great things about buying produce is you can buy it loose so you can buy almost exactly what you need when it comes to, um, cooking vegetable dishes. Um, rather than having to buy more than what you may need from, from the beginning. Now you've also got some recipes for leftovers. What can people do, for instance, with leftover mashed potatoes? Well, we've heard that you can make a Mashpee or mashed potato pizza. So, um, we also had a great tip about, um, roasting broccoli Spears. Speaker 14: 33:29 Sometimes that's the most undesirable portion of the, of the piece of broccoli. But roasting broccoli spear softens it up and makes it very delicious. I'm at waste free sd.org. We have posted, um, resources for not only preparing for your meal but also planning for leftovers. One of my favorites was, uh, uh, leftover stuffing waffles. That's an interesting one. Leftovers. Well, leftovers are the best part I hear. So. Okay. So is there any way to dispose of the meat that is leftover in a better way than just sending it off to the landfill? I think, you know, going back to that world war reference that I made, um, and, and people are still doing this today obviously, but um, you can make broths, um, and really use the most out of what you're purchasing before you even consider putting it in the trash. You know, we're going to produce some waste. The bottom line is, is one way we're preparing for everything. It's rethinking perhaps the way we approach our meal and then just having in our mind reducing from the get go. Um, what we're going to purchase, uh, to begin with. I've been speaking with Ian Monahan with, I love a clean San Diego. Thank you for your tips and happy Thanksgiving. Happy Thanksgiving to you. Thank you. Speaker 1: 34:51 [inaudible] border art can be art at the actual border or art about the border, or sometimes it's both. And a new episode of only here, the KPBS podcast about the unexplored cultural territory at the us Mexico border host Allan Boolean Thall kicks off a new series of episodes specifically about border art and today's excerpt. Alan talks to a Tijuana artists known as the godfather of border art about his famous Trojan horse sculpture and a new sculpture he built at the border. This summer. The story is Speaker 14: 35:29 unforgettable. The Greeks constructed a giant wooden horse, hidden men inside it and then pretended Speaker 15: 35:38 to sail away. The Trojan war was raging Speaker 5: 35:44 [inaudible]. Speaker 15: 35:45 The Trojans, assuming their opponents had given up and split, dragged the horse into their city as a trophy of SerDes. That night, the Greek warriors crept out of the hollow inside of the horse and opened the Gates for the rest of the Greek army. The city of Troy was destroyed. Once upon a time, a Trojan horse did. Here at the U S Mexico [inaudible] board, the giant wooden horse had two heads and straddled the international borderline. One had in [inaudible], the other in San Diego. It sat here for nearly a year in 1997 in clear view of the thousands of cars and pedestrians who crossed the San Ysidro port of entry every day. The horse was a sculpture, a temporary work of art by Tiguan artists. Maracle Shamez who somehow convinced the authorities to let him put his politically charged art at the border without having to cut through a bunch of red tape. Speaker 16: 36:52 Well, it wasn't even world. I only have to go and convince the director of the port of entry. Everybody is throwing me before like, no, you're not going to make up change that's going to allow you or whatever. And I went there, I, I played my, my card say these come some politics the day that I went in and suggested and show the renderings and the Makeathon, although after the lady she wasn't already with Moo. And then she said there's going to be a committee meeting between three officials from [inaudible] and three officials from San Diego that are meeting in like two hours. And you hang around and and hope go and have a drink or soda come back and if you convince them and you have a democratic boat, we can do it. Speaker 15: 37:33 The vote was four to two so he parked the horse which was mounted on giant wooden wheels at the border Speaker 5: 37:40 [inaudible] Speaker 15: 37:46 it's hard to know what people who saw the whores thought of it. It definitely would have evoked the secret of Greek invasion for those. Familiar with the story from Marco's who's mostly known by his nickname editor. The piece had a clear message. The two headed creatures symbolized both the feelings of mutual exchange and invasion at the U S Mexico border editor wanted to provoke thought and conversation about that relationship. Who is invading whom, who depends on whom, who will be on the right side of history. Two decades have passed since the horse straddled the border and airy. A former construction worker is now one of the most prolific and well known border artists in the world. His helped him earn a big time commission this summer. He again put up a sculpture at the actual border. But this time it wasn't as DIY. It went through the official public art channels for the federal government and the federal government actually footed the bill for those who follow Erez work. It's sort of shocking since he's such an antiwar kind of guy. The punk rock at times, gorilla style artists known for criticizing the very existence of the border wall has now worked for the same government that is funding and expansion. Speaker 17: 39:12 [inaudible] Speaker 16: 39:13 I didn't believe that that was happening. And then they weren't going to allow me to do a piece. You have to come and see and then come up with an idea of these pieces as, as a belligerent as the other one or, or maybe already is to do it by the pressure of the money or the mutation or whatever. And then I had, uh, the time to think about how, how am I going to do to put an auditorium horse in the border without being offensive? You know? So I, so that's, that's where I able to think of, reside in the interpretation of the work, Speaker 15: 39:48 Eric sculptures. It's just feet away from the entrance of the newest pedestrian border crossing at the port of entry. It's a large piece and at first glance it looks like a giant hourglass. The frame is made of big black steel beam. Speaker 15: 40:07 The beams hold two large cones in place. The one on top is narrow side down like an upside down pyramid and the one on the bottom is narrow side up. A gap about an inch wide sits between the pointed tips of the two cones, the words todos Somos, these Tintos or we are all distinct are etched into the bottom cone and etched into the top cone are the words we are all equal. Aira likes to use texts in his work as a conceptual artist and artists whose first and most important medium is ideas. He likes to leave his work open to interpretation, but he also likes to provide parameters. That's what the text does. It points people in a certain direction, Speaker 16: 40:52 half of the work, or at least it's just one's ability of the viewer. So I, I blamed my seat and I hope people come in and water the tree. Speaker 15: 41:03 Eric doesn't like being didactic or overexplaining his art, but we were able to squeeze an explanation out of him anyway. Speaker 16: 41:11 Well, you have these two positions that look like they are a counter position or like against each other. But at the very end, it's the same thing. We are all distinct as a fact and we are all equal in the eyes of the law and the eyes of God, whatever. If you believe in God, pick the one you want, you know, and then, and then that's the way it should be. We are all equal and a, and, and, but at the same time, we, we should be, uh, able to, to really value our differences and the things that this team does culturally and physically in, in many fields. You know, that's, that's basically the, the idea behind the piece. Speaker 18: 42:03 Mm Hmm. Speaker 15: 42:03 So this bold new symbol of equality sits just a Stone's throw away from the border fence, which has been topped with menacing looking razor wires since Trump took office. Lots of people see the border wall itself as a brazen symbol of inequality, a physical representation of the U S seeing Mexico as different and lesser not equal. So while editor's new sculpture is not nearly as aggressive or antagonistic as his famous Trojan horse. His new piece at the border wall is quietly and poetically protesting any policy that might treat people as unequal. To hear the rest of this only here podcast episode, go to kpbs.org/podcast Speaker 18: 43:29 [inaudible].