California reaches vaccination milestone but threat of winter surge looms

Speaker 1: (00:01)

California reaches a vaccine, mild

Speaker 2: (00:04)

And San Diego county. We're looking at almost 82% of people that have at least one dose

Speaker 1: (00:10)

Hindman with Maureen Kavanaugh. This is KPBS mid-day edition. Inflation is up. So what exactly does that mean for your wallet?

Speaker 3: (00:29)

Uh, it is one area of where, where, where there's, there's a big impact on nationally. Gasoline is up almost 50% compared to a year ago,

Speaker 1: (00:38)

The history of race and vigilantism as two high profile cases unfold. And we'll tell you about the last fresh sound concert series. That's ahead on midday edition,

Speaker 1: (01:01)

California has reached a considerable vaccine milestone with 70% of the state's population. Now inoculated with at least one dose of the COVID-19 vaccine. While the number itself is a hopeful sign for an increasing rate of vaccination across the state, millions remain only partially vaccinated or not vaccinated at all. As the winter months, approach health experts warned that this lack of strengthened immunity among so many in California could very well lead to another surge of cases here now to discuss how efforts have gone locally is KPBS health reporter, Matt Hoffman, Matt. Welcome back. How does San Diego's vaccination rate compare to the statewide rate?

Speaker 2: (01:43)

It's actually a little bit higher. Uh, you know, the statewide rate, as you mentioned now, clocking in at 70%, uh, in San Diego county, we're looking at 81%, almost 82% of people that have at least one dose. So that's a pretty high number. And then if you look at fully vaccinated, uh, you know, the statewide rate a little bit higher than 66%, um, in San Diego county, uh, it's about 73%

Speaker 1: (02:05)

In San Diego, still a leader in the state when it comes to having its residents facts.

Speaker 2: (02:10)

Definitely. I mean, even just looking at those numbers were higher than the statewide average or one of the counties that's helping bring that up. There are some smaller counties that do have some higher vaccination rates than San Diego, but definitely a leader in California.

Speaker 1: (02:22)

How have recently expanded efforts to vaccinate children aged five to 11 in San Diego gone so far?

Speaker 2: (02:29)

Yeah, so we've had a little bit of time. Uh, we have gotten some data from county health officials, uh, that tell us, uh, over 7,000 kids ages five to 11, uh, have gotten at least their first dose, uh, of the Pfizer vaccine. Um, and you know, just, just anecdotally, um, you know, we were out, uh, at the county LivWell center in Chula Vista yesterday. And while there was this a significant, good amount of people there trying to get their booster shots. Um, the, the majority of people that were there, it was parents and kids who were there to get vaccinated. Um, and it is, you know, we talked to one gentleman who was there from, uh, from Mexico. He came from Tijuana. Um, they're not vaccinating kids over 18 there. Um, so it's going to take some time for people cause you know, they have to, you know, either give their permission if it's a school that with like a permission slip or actually bring their kids so a slow going process, but there was a lot of kids in line.

Speaker 1: (03:16)

So our efforts to distribute booster shots going in San Diego county,

Speaker 2: (03:21)

Definitely going slower than the rollout, uh, for vaccines originally. Right. Um, you know, we're not seeing any of the super big, large super stations. Uh, most of the booster shots, uh, a tip to check ahead, you, you likely need an appointment or there are some county sites that are offering walk-ins, but you're going to want to check their websites. Sometimes it's only on certain days, I'm sort of a slow rollout. Um, but there are people, you know, um, that, that are getting them,

Speaker 1: (03:44)

We've done some reporting on San Diego residents and their reasoning behind getting a booster shot. What are you hearing from people in the community?

Speaker 2: (03:51)

Definitely talking to the people that are over the, you know, 65 and older group, they're getting it because, you know, not only does the CDC recommend that that group gets it, but because they say that they trust the science and they're following the science, then what we hear from a lot of people is that they're getting it because they just want to be as protected as possible from this virus. We know, especially in older people, that immunity can wane quicker than some of the younger people. So that's basically why they're getting it to be as protected as possible

Speaker 1: (04:15)

Nationally. There's been some confusion over who's actually eligible for a booster. Are we seeing that here in San Diego

Speaker 2: (04:22)

As well? You know, we may have been seeing some of that before when the CDC was sort of saying, you know, okay, you know, older people can get it, you know, people at work in some high-risk settings, but just, just recently last Friday, the state's public health director, you know, put out a notice saying, you know, don't turn away anyone. So now in California, if you're over the age of 18 and it's been at least six months since your dose, you can go in there and get your booster shot. Uh, sort of no questions asked, you know, you don't have to provide any proof of having an underlying medical condition, even though before I think it was just self at test station. Anyway,

Speaker 1: (04:51)

What kind of rhetoric are we hearing from local health officials about the need to get boosters and get younger children vaccinated?

Speaker 2: (04:58)

Yeah. You know, when boosters were first rolled out, they sort of said, Hey, if you're eligible for a booster, go and get it. So they definitely want people to get a booster, especially as we approach some of the holidays, uh, where we know, you know, we've seen cases go up in the past. Obviously this year could be a little bit different, uh, with that vaccination wall, but they're definitely encouraging, you know, parents to go out there and bring some of their kids out. Uh, we do know that nationally, uh, the federal government's launching a campaign, not only targeting children, but targeting their parents too. And trying to address some of that misinformation. That's maybe feeling some vaccine hesitancy among adults, our

Speaker 1: (05:31)

Local physicians and health officials worried about a winter

Speaker 2: (05:34)

Surge. I think there's always a worry about a winter surge. Um, especially, you know, we hear hearing from the governor saying, you know, cases are starting to increase when sort of the way governor Newsome puts it. As you know, this is sort of simple, you know, we saw this happened before we know how the virus acts. Now we know a lot more about the virus, how contagious it can be, you know, in some of these indoor spaces. Um, and if there's, you know, some gatherings this holiday where there's a lot of people that are unmasked and has it, um, it can spread definitely extremely fast. Um, so it's something that they're definitely monitoring, but keep in mind, Jade, I mean, you know, here in San Diego county, you know, 73% of residents are fully vaccinated. So there is a wall of vaccination about, we know what the Delta variant, how contagious it is. We know experts have said that the virus will find those people who are unvaccinated. It's just a question of is that a, you know, enough people to sort of overwhelm the hospitals like we saw during the last winter search. Okay.

Speaker 1: (06:24)

And finally, uh, breaking news justice morning, Pfizer said it is asking us regulators to authorize its experimental pill for COVID-19, which has been shown to cut hospitalizations and deaths. Given what we know, how long do you suspect that process of getting authorized, uh, of getting an authorization to take?

Speaker 2: (06:43)

I think it's definitely going to be a sped up process. I think like we saw with the vaccines, you know, they want to maintain the integrity of the process, but they also want to make sure that if it is a life saving drug, if it is a saving, you know, recipe that they want to get it to people

Speaker 1: (06:56)

We've been speaking with KPBS health reporter, Matt Hoffman, Matt, thank you so much for joining us.

Speaker 2: (07:01)

Thanks Shane

Speaker 4: (07:11)

Prices at the gas pump and the supermarket are bringing home the big headlines about inflation and those headlines have been screaming about the highest inflation rate in 30 years, a 6.2% jump in the consumer price index and price hikes are even higher on individual items like gas, groceries, and automobiles. The truth is right now, many Americans have more buying power than there are goods to buy. So inflation, the question is, did bad policies create that situation and can it be turned around anytime soon? Joining me is Alan gin, economics professor at the university of San Diego and professor gin, welcome to the program. Thanks for having me. Where are San Diego and seeing the biggest consumer price increases?

Speaker 3: (07:59)

The home is up, uh, nationally, uh, over 5%. Um, if you look at the individual components of that index in particular, what I would call the proteins have been up considerably. So in the category, meat, poultry, fish, and eggs, that's up almost 12% year over year. These are national numbers as opposed to San Diego numbers. But I think the San Diego numbers will post, we reflect what's happening across the country. So again, food, uh, is one area of where, where, where there's, there's a big impact. As you mentioned also though, uh, gasoline, uh, nationally gasoline is up, uh, almost 50%, uh, compared to a year ago. And, uh, we just recently in California here hit an all time high in terms of the average price per gallon

Speaker 4: (08:42)

Is our situation here in San Diego, unique in any way, making us more or less prone to inflationary pressures.

Speaker 3: (08:50)

The team that would be unique about San Diego is that we're kind of a cul-de-sac. So we're at the end of the line, as far as the supply chain is concerned. And if there are disruptions in the supply chain that could affect us here. Uh, another thing that we have, uh, unique in San Diego, uh, but not unique to coastal California is the high housing prices. And we have here even during the pandemic, uh, the housing market remains strong and as we're cutting out a bit, and what we're seeing is we're just seeing that the cost of housing is soaring.

Speaker 4: (09:20)

Remind us what the pressures are. That's creating this inflation. Why are these price increases happening?

Speaker 3: (09:26)

There's a wide series of events that's causing this inflation. If we go and take a look at the food side, there's been a number of weather related incidents that are occurring just around the world. Uh, for example, there was this big heat dome earlier in the year over, uh, north America. And that has devastated the, uh, [inaudible], um, not just in the U S but in Canada as well. It's been estimated that the Canadian wheat harvest is going to be down 35% this year compared then, uh, compared to what was, uh, forecast. And, and so, uh, not only does that have an impact on stuff made out of wheat, but it's affecting the price of feed, for example, because the corn crop has been affected as well. And so that has affected the price of meat. As I mentioned earlier, meat is up almost to 12% compared to last year.

Speaker 3: (10:18)

And high feed costs are, are one reason, uh, as far as that's concerned, but, uh, there's also been problems as far as the supply chain. Uh, we've got problems with the supply chain, uh, offloading of ships is difficult. Uh, just problems all up and down the supply chain. Uh, there's a shortage of drivers of trucks. Uh, there's also shortages of labor at, uh, warehouses and distribution centers. And so that is hurting when the distribution of goods and that's leading to shortages and prices to rise. And then finally, uh, there's been a labor. Uh, there's been a problem as far as labor is concerned, uh, in, in the, in the sense that there's a lot of job openings, but not enough people to fill those job openings in 2020 and extra 2 million people retired compared to what was projected. There are also a problem with women coming back to the workforce due to childcare issues. So that prayed a lot of job openings. And as a result, people are leaving their jobs at a record rate, a report just came out last week, that September we had an all time high in terms of the number of number killed, quitting their jobs. And this is now we're having trouble finding workers. Uh, they have to pay higher wages, and that is also contributing then to an increase in places.

Speaker 4: (11:28)

Nope. Could we see this inflation as kind of the flip side of the good news that we are not in a pandemic recession?

Speaker 3: (11:36)

I think that's definitely the case. Uh, you know, part of the reasons why we have such a high rate of inflation compared to last year was that prices were depressed, uh, last year, uh, for example, uh, the prices of use cars well that's because the used car market was the press last year. Due to fact that rental car companies were uploading their fleets because nobody was renting cars because travel was down. Uh, and now those rental car companies are having to rebuild their fleets. As a result of that, uh, the price of used cars is, is up considerably. I actually did the price of used cards up about, uh, 25% compared to compared to last year. It's the rental rates that, that are up about, uh, about 40%. But if you could apply this into all parts of the economy, uh, the fact that the gas prices are so high is due to the fact that the economy is open now, and people are driving. Businesses are operating. We have production in factories that has driven the price of oil from less than $10 a barrel at the bottom of the recession last year, over $80 a barrel. So the price of oil goes from $10 a barrel to over 80. That's going to cause gas prices two to increase. But again, that's the consequence then of the world. Autonomy reopening

Speaker 4: (12:46)

Have government policies triggered inflation.

Speaker 3: (12:49)

That's a difficult thing to say. A lot of people, uh, for example, thought that these extra payments that people were getting due to, uh, unemployment insurance, uh, was keeping people out of the labor force. But now those things expired in September and we're still having then, uh, a shortage of labor. So there were other factors in that that caused them that shortage of labor. We did have a stimulus package passed the review of this year, so that put money more money then in people's hands. So that helped revive the economy. But as you mentioned, there's a trade-off thing as the economy revives, uh, people want to spend that money and that, that could be then tightened up, uh, backing up prices

Speaker 4: (13:27)

And do more to stop rising prices. I mean, could they increase interest rates for example,

Speaker 3: (13:32)

And it is a job been for the federal reserve and technically the federal reserve is independent from the government. And so, uh, at this point, the, the federal reserve has held the line as far as interest rates are concerned. I think that you'll see interest rates are rising in 2022, um, maybe up to, up to a half a percent. Uh, and so that will help in terms of pulling down a bit of inflation. Um, it will float the growth of the economy a little bit, but, but I think there's enough underlying strength in the economy that, that, uh, it can take it.

Speaker 4: (14:00)

And what things might have be a good idea to postpone purchasing right now.

Speaker 3: (14:04)

Yeah. So, so what happened was that during the pandemic, uh, when things were shut down, people spend more time at home. Uh, either they were out of the job or they were working from home. And as a result of that, people started buying stuff related to the whole furniture, uh, appliances, the teepees, uh, computers, things, things like that. And as a result, uh, that has caused a shortage in those areas because the factories that were producing other goods had to be retooled in order to produce the goods that people wanted. And so that is also causing some of the problems that we're having been in the supply chain, but that's caused the price of things like computers and furniture to rise considerably. And so I think if you can put off buying in those areas, I think we'll see prices come down in the future as the supply chain gets itself, sorted out. Okay.

Speaker 4: (14:55)

When do you think this inflation bubble will start to deflate?

Speaker 3: (14:59)

We want to see in 2022 that, uh, prices will still be rising faster than, than desired, but the rate is going to be best. Um, as you mentioned in the last report had inflation at 6.2%. I think we'll see inflation into the three and 3% range in 2022. That's still higher than the target that the federal reserve usually has a 2%, but I think we'll see a lot of the issues in the supply chain sorted out, not completely. And also then some of these would these unusual comparisons to a depressed year reverse themselves.

Speaker 4: (15:32)

Well, I've been speaking with Alan gin, professor of economics at the university of San Diego. Allen, thank you very much. Thanks. This is KPBS midday edition. I'm Maureen Cavenaugh with Jade Heinemann earlier in the show, economist, Alan gin talked about how people retiring and leaving their jobs. Since the pandemic has helped increase inflation. Many employers say they're having a hard time finding workers, and the pressure is on to increase salaries, California report host Saul Gonzalez wanted to see what hiring looks like now and what workers are thinking as they look for jobs. So he went to a jobs fair.

Speaker 5: (16:22)

So good morning, and welcome to the ledger to shop there. After you go through your security screening, you'll come and check in at the check-in table. You'll scan the QR code for the specific job application that you would like to apply for today. Then once again, good morning and welcome. Come on in.

Speaker 6: (16:39)

I've come to so fire stadium in Inglewood, that's home to the Los Angeles, Rams and chargers, but this morning jobs not sports are front and center. The stadium is looking for about 2000 workers for both full and part-time positions from cooks and bartenders, security guards and guest attendance. 24 year old Palestina. Washington has come here with high hopes. She's currently a home healthcare worker, but is tired of the low pay and is ready for a change. What are you looking for job wise right now?

Speaker 7: (17:11)

Just the next adventure. You know, each job was supposed to be something new, something uncharted, and I've never worked for a stadium. I would like to see what that life is like. And this is a great opportunity to tilt because it's fresh and it's screaming for help,

Speaker 6: (17:27)

Screaming for help, and looking for a lot of people, hire a lot of people

Speaker 7: (17:29)

Here. So if you say you can't get a job, you're not looking hard in this economy right now, right now, as of right now. Yes.

Speaker 6: (17:37)

So I met my. What is the bare minimum for you when you're looking for a new job now, whether it's pay or time off, what's an absolute must have for right now,

Speaker 7: (17:49)

Benefits, dental, vision, you know, the basics.

Speaker 6: (17:55)

Hey, if I can ask, could I seem something that's north of $20 an hour,

Speaker 7: (17:59)

It'd be something, something that's livable,

Speaker 6: (18:03)

Something where you can put food on the table, keep a roof over

Speaker 7: (18:05)

Your head, have a little bit of change for guests.

Speaker 6: (18:08)

A little bit of change for gas. It is LA after all, hello, For a wider view about the California labor market. Right now, I talked to heinie Sudano. He helps run a union back training academy for workers in the hospitality field. And co-organized this hiring fair. Sodano says the situation for workers has changed enormously in recent months, mostly for the good as businesses, recovering from the pandemic. Roll out the welcome mat for new hires.

Speaker 8: (18:37)

The fact that so many places shut down and so many businesses actually had closed their doors. Uh, this shows that, you know, we're, we're opening back up, we're getting ready to bring the community back to work.

Speaker 6: (18:48)

Do you think that folks here standing in line for a job are in a stronger position to get what they want from employers? And they would have been before the pandemic, just the way the job market is right now? Absolutely.

Speaker 8: (19:00)

The reason why the market is so strong is because there a lot of people that still can't, or won't go back to work, uh, and these folks have the ability to almost, you know, get what they want because there's so many more jobs than people right now.

Speaker 6: (19:13)

Correct. And people who actually get a gig here who walk out of here, or we'll hear about a job that they can get here will be paid from what, to what generally speaking

Speaker 8: (19:22)

$16 and above 16, up to $22. It really depends on the position. Uh, some people above California members absolutely above count five minimum, and that's kind of the norm now. And that is the norm. And especially working in a union environment with certain contracts. Once you work enough hours, you do qualify for benefits also,

Speaker 6: (19:38)

But Sodano acknowledges that even with higher pay and more benefits, many Californians with new jobs will still struggle to get by because of a high cost of living in the state and growing inflation, that's taking a bigger bite out of paychecks. And we'll note that California skill has a fairly high official unemployment rate at seven and a half percent. And some studies indicate a tire, but the people at this stadium jobs fair, hopeful that a new job here or someplace else will provide them with fresh starts. As she comes out of her employment interview, I run into Palestina, Washington again and ask how it went.

Speaker 7: (20:14)

They were really good. I like what I was hearing. If people seem friendly there, they seem like they, they want to teach you something more than what you know. So, and

Speaker 6: (20:24)

When do you think you're going to hear something back from them?

Speaker 7: (20:26)

Uh, they said within two weeks, and that will be my congratulations. Thank you for joining the team. Oh,

Speaker 6: (20:32)

I literally have a gig here within two weeks. All right. Well, good luck to you. I really appreciate it.

Speaker 7: (20:39)

Have a great day.

Speaker 4: (20:41)

That piece was reported by California report host Saul Gonzalez.

Speaker 1: (20:52)

Two cases are unfolding in this country right now were white males took up arms and killed unarmed people. They claimed in the name of public safety. And in both cases, they are also claiming self-defense right now. Jury deliberations are underway in the Kyle Rittenhouse case. Lawyers for Rittenhouse say he was acting in self-defense when he killed two people during a social justice protest last year and Wisconsin, the trial over a mod Alberese killing is in its second week. Our Berry was out for a jog in his Brunswick, Georgia neighborhood. When he was gunned down by three white men who thought he looked suspicious, they too are claiming self-defense. This is where I want to talk about the intersection of vigilantism and race. Joining me is Dr. [inaudible] professor of Africana studies at SDSU professor Al cable. On welcome back to the program.

Speaker 9: (21:42)

Thank you so much for having me. If you could

Speaker 1: (21:45)

Put these two cases into historical context,

Speaker 9: (21:48)

The, the history between white vigilantes and law enforcement is long and painful. As early as colonial America, white colonists were deputized into slave patrolling and slave catching. They had the full weight of the law to apprehend enslaved people and form a militia in the event of slavery volts. So patrollers policed, all movement and unsupervised activity through passes, detainments interrogations, um, cert unrestrained search and seizures of slave quarters. And this was legally sanctioned. Uh, and they also had, uh, legally sanctioned on spot, violent punishment for the slightest infringement of slave laws and customs. They were armed with guns, with whips, with bloodhounds, uh, and the, the patrollers. They addressed some of the concerns or white concerns that, uh, blacks were the foremost threat to their way of life. Uh, and again, they were authorized by by county courts. So, uh, slave patrols scrutinized every aspect of black lives with the power to spontaneously meet out, you know, any corporal punishment that they deemed fit. Uh, they were, you know, so to speak the first responders to threats, uh, and actual slave insurgencies. Uh, so the slave patrols were, you know, the closest armed defenders of white supremacists know social norms,

Speaker 1: (23:24)

Given that, do you feel like this is this current moment in time, is history repeating itself?

Speaker 9: (23:31)

You know, America is being America. The experiences of African-Americans have not significantly changed with regard to these issues of, uh, vigilantism uh, or, or policing, you know, so there is a long pattern and history, uh, of it that's on a continuum.

Speaker 1: (23:52)

Uh, what role do you think the Trump administration played in emboldening? This type of activity?

Speaker 9: (23:58)

The Trump administration definitely emboldened many white Americans because of its rhetoric and close associations with white supremacist, Donald Trump's rhetoric, uh, was mean-spirited. It was racist and it was often violent. Uh, the insurrection that occurred on January six is a very, is very relevant to this discussion because it was a symptom of the toxicity of the Trump administration, but also reflective of the deep seated historical racial animus among a specific population that exists in this country. So while Donald Trump is not the boogeyman responsible for all racism in this country, certainly his administration in bold Bolden, a hateful and violent constituency in this country.

Speaker 1: (24:42)

How do you think this plays out as the movement for social justice continues?

Speaker 9: (24:46)

Well, it should remind us that the struggle to live in a truly egalitarian and just society continues. There is no room for any of us to be complacent Americans of good faith and good conscience must remain engaged and take every opportunity and every resource available to them, uh, to fight for change.

Speaker 1: (25:08)

And I want to talk a bit more about the trial happening for the men who killed a mod are Berry. Uh, this week, the defense filed a motion and told the court, we don't want any more black pastors in here and explain their presence could be intimidating to jurors, even went to make a strange analogy. Do people dress like Colonel Sanders wearing white masks in court? There's a lot to unpack there. What do you make of it?

Speaker 9: (25:32)

Well, I don't understand that analogy, uh, but you know, the, the irony, uh, the tragic irony is that these men hunted Ahmad Arbery down and killed him. You know, the sheer terror and intimidation that he must have felt as a result of these men following assaulting, and ultimately murdering him. Must've been unthinkable to most of us. And then for the same thugs, if you will, uh, to raise issue with, you know, pastors, men of the cloth, uh, but more importantly, they are black men is unconscionable, but it also fits into the narrative that black men represent a threat to the American way of life.

Speaker 1: (26:21)

What are some of the things that stand out to you most in terms of how these cases are being handled in court

Speaker 9: (26:28)

Stands out the most for me is that generally speaking, white men have the luxury of claiming self-defense, uh, unfortunately, uh, black men and other people of color do not generally have that privilege. In fact, an entire movement was demonized for daring to embrace the notion of self-defense referring to me, uh, the black power movement, but also, you know, affirming that black lives matter is controversial, you know, is threatening. We're all familiar with the high profile George Zimmerman case, you know, in the stand, your ground law in Florida, a law that didn't protect the black woman who shot a gun into the air wore off and abuser Marissa Alexander. Uh, but in any event, another thing that stands out is just the adult suffocation of black boys. So while Kyle Rittenhouse is being betrayed, uh, as a kid he's often referred to as a kid, no 12 year old Tamir rice was gunned down within three seconds of the arrival of law enforcement, uh, who claimed that he looked like an adult or Trayvon Martin who believed who was believed to have been an adult. That's what George Zimmerman alleged, uh, but the narratives, uh, are just very different, but more important than the narrative. The reality, the outcome, uh, oftentimes are very different when a white men and boys are involved,

Speaker 1: (27:58)

What does justice look like to you in these cases? And where does the country go? Once they've concluded,

Speaker 9: (28:04)

The evictions would be a great start, but without a change in policy and the way that we police people of color, unless that changes, it will be just rinse and repeat. And after the year that 2020 was a lot of African-Americans were hopeful that this country was on a genuine, sincere path to change. But with these two particular chases, it was a reality check or a lot of African-Americans. And unfortunately many are not as hopeful as, as they were.

Speaker 1: (28:45)

I've been speaking with Dr. ADESA cable on professor of Africana studies at SDSU professor cable Balaam. Thank you so much for joining.

Speaker 9: (28:53)

You're welcome. And thank you for the invitation.

Speaker 1: (29:02)

Why do streets look the way they do? Why are they so often designed for cars first and pedestrians and cyclists? Second KPBS, Metro reporter, Andrew Bowen, dove into those questions with Chuck Marone. He's president of the nonprofit strong towns and author of the new book, confessions of a recovering engineer. So

Speaker 10: (29:23)

It goes to title your book, confessions of a recovering engineer. What are you recovering from

Speaker 11: (29:28)

Man? I'm recovering from decades a decade or more of, of, uh, of indoctrination. I mean, really when you become a civil engineer, when you become a municipal engineer and you start doing things, traffic and sewer and water and all that stuff, there's a certain approach that is given to you that you inherit. Uh, you're given a book of standards you're given like, you know, the best practices of a profession, and you have this expectation to follow that, particularly if you want to get ahead. And so for me, there was a certain, uh, kind of mystique that came with joining this profession and learning those things and, and, and adopting them as like the way things should be, uh, that I had to unlearn that I really had to go through and get out of my brain

Speaker 10: (30:16)

Throughout your book. You keep returning to this one, particularly horrific crash that happened on December 3rd, 2014 and Springfield, Massachusetts. Tell us what happened there.

Speaker 11: (30:26)

Uh, mom, uh, with two little girls was leaving the library in Springfield, Massachusetts, uh, late at night. Uh, they crossed the street, uh, headed to the parking lot, which is directly across this four lane highway. That's been built through the middle of the city. Um, they did this, uh, in kind of the most natural of ways. And a car came along, struck them, uh, put the one girl in the hospital and then killed seven-year-old destiny Gonzales. Um, this has happened many times at this location. And in fact, we're speaking today on, uh, November 12th, 2021 on November 11th, yesterday. Uh, one of the employees of the library walked out of library was walking across the street in this exact same location to get in her car. And she was struck and killed in the same spot. And so this is a crossing that has a long history of taking lives and a long history of mismatch between the design of the street and the goals and objectives of the engineer in this case, and the health and safety of this community.

Speaker 10: (31:37)

A lot of these aspects that make a street very unsafe or inhospitable for pedestrians, I learned from your book are actually designed to be safe, at least from the perspective of an old school traffic engineers. So describe for me what a safe street looks like from that perspective. And what do you see wrong with that picture? When you're designing

Speaker 11: (31:57)

In a highway, there's some very like clear things that you do to make the highway safer for drivers, you widen out the lanes you add in recovery areas. You add in clear zones, you basically create a lot of buffer so that the driver of the vehicle has a lot of room to react to things that might happen you from a design standpoint, forgive the mistakes that a driver would make by creating all this buffer. When you bring that mindset into an urban area, what happens is that urban areas are full of complexity. They're full of automobiles. You that's randomly stop or turn or cut across traffic. You have people walking, people walking across the street in crosswalks, not in crosswalks. You have people on bikes. You have people in wheelchairs, you have the dog that gets loose and runs across the street. You have the kid who chases the kickball.

Speaker 11: (32:50)

So you have all of this complexity, the simultaneous that complexity, what you have done with the street design is actually signaled to drivers. We've got your back. We have provided you with lots of buffer room. You've got all kinds of safety factor. And the reality is, is that is the wrong message to send a drivers because what drivers do in, in an urban area, when you give them lots of room is they speed up and we've just, we're signaling the wrong things to drivers. We're signaling to drivers that this is a simple environment like a highway. And so you don't have to pay really rigid, close attention. And most of the time, that's very true, but in these random occurrences where things are not where we expect them to be tragedy occurs and it occurs,

Speaker 10: (33:34)

What are the common themes that you find in cities that have made a lot of progress toward better street design and safer street design? What are the ingredients for success?

Speaker 11: (33:43)

I see a lot of places that want to do things differently, and then they run up against the rules and regulations and the ones that are very, um, dogmatic about like what the rules and regulations are. They get stuck at that point. They struggle. They're like, well, we can't do this because.dot dot, and the ones that thrive are the ones not that say, well, throw out the rule book and, you know, be careless and like, who really cares? They are like, okay, here's an obstacle. We've run up against how do we get around this obstacle? How do we find a local adaptation to this? And a lot of times that involves changing staff. A lot of times that involves, you know, creating a different channel for where this workflow would go. But a lot of times it just requires us to sit down and collaborate.

Speaker 10: (34:32)

San Diego has set some very ambitious goals with cutting back on driving. It's adopted a vision zero goal to end all traffic deaths and serious injuries by 2025. It, uh, recently, or is in the process of updating its climate action plan, which calls for half of all trips in the city to be made via biking, walking, or public transit by 2035. But I don't think city leaders have a very clear picture of how they're going to get there exactly how they'll accomplish that. What do you think would have to change and how would our streets and our neighborhoods look differently? If that is the goal,

Speaker 11: (35:11)

People would have to accept congestion as not a problem, but as actually a manifestation of the system that we built a system that needs to change. If you're going to meet those goals and you would actually have to embrace congestion for what it is, which is a sign of a demand for local alternatives and buy local alternatives, that kind of gets to the second part, which is in order to reach these goals, which I think are very goals, very worthy goals. Um, what you need to have is not a transportation approach. You need to have a neighborhood development approach because to get to that goal, to require people, to have alternatives near them, that they can walk to alternatives near them, that they can bite to it. Doesn't you're not going to get there by taking the Strode environment that you've created today, or the highway environment you created it and like appendage a trail on the side of it, or, you know, appendage like an overpass to get people to walk over that that's not, that's not the way it's going to work. The only way you get to that goal is to actually build neighborhoods, neighborhoods where people can replace their longer distance trips with local trips. So I need milk. I need bread. I need to get my hair cut. I need to do, you know, whatever basic like thing I do on a typical day, that's gotta be, there has to be an alternative for that locally.

Speaker 1: (36:29)

That was Chuck Marone, author of confessions of a recovering engineer. Speaking with KPBS as Andrew Bowen, Marone is giving a talk on Thursday at 4:00 PM at the San Diego history center in Balboa park.

Speaker 4: (36:48)

This is KPBS mid day edition. I'm Maureen Kavanaugh with Jade Heinemann music that's out of the main stream can be left unheard, but that hasn't been the case in San Diego for the last 24 years. One woman has maintained a series of concerts devoted to cutting edge music. This Friday, the last fresh sound concert takes place and it's curator producer manager and creator Bonnie, right? We'll move on to her. Next thing. Bonnie has become an icon in San Diego and throughout the avant garde music world for her fresh sound's concerts. It's a pleasure to have her on midday, Bonnie. Welcome.

Speaker 12: (37:29)

Thank you. Nice to be here. How

Speaker 4: (37:31)

Difficult was it to make the decision to wrap up the fresh sound series?

Speaker 12: (37:37)

Oh, it was very hard. The word that comes to mind that I've used is bittersweet and what I said again and again, but I like it is, I've had 224 concerts in 24 years. I'm now 83 and eight times three is 24. So that was my signal.

Speaker 4: (38:01)

And it's as good a reason as Eddie's I suppose, is that right?

Speaker 12: (38:05)

I guess

Speaker 4: (38:08)

Now for someone who's never been to one of the fresh sound concerts, can you describe the kind of music they might've heard there?

Speaker 12: (38:17)

My idea was to bring music to San Diego that they wouldn't otherwise here. And so I had spent a lot of time in New York and I got to know musicians there. So I bring them here. Well, at first I brought people from San Diego D cause I went back to school as an older person in the music department. So the first concert was Steve Schick and I should bring up my history. But then after I went to New York, I, um, I've started bringing him here,

Speaker 4: (38:54)

How the concert's been difficult to maintain through the years.

Speaker 12: (38:58)

No, they haven't. The main thing is to not do it for, for money because you'd never ever make any money on this. So if you do it for the love of music, then it's easy.

Speaker 4: (39:10)

Here's a track featuring UC San Diego, professor of music, Steven Schick, no stranger to fresh sound, along with the bang on a can, all stars and others in a piece called cheating, lying, stealing. How many people show up to an, a typical concert? Well,

Speaker 12: (40:04)

I'm always pleased or was always pleased, uh, when, at least 40 to 45 people showed up, but sometimes there was less for this final concert we're sold out, which is a hundred and twenty-five people.

Speaker 4: (40:19)

And what about that thing about getting artists to perform for these concerts? How have you managed that?

Speaker 12: (40:26)

Mainly when, like for people, the artists from out of town, I would ask them, you know, when they're in the neighborhood in LA or San Francisco, then come on down to San Diego and they were always happy to perform. They, you know, especially the, uh, I guess you could call it avant-garde or contemporary music. People don't get that big of opportunity because people like what's familiar

Speaker 4: (40:54)

And you would sometimes put them up at your

Speaker 12: (40:56)

House. I'll almost always yes. And that was really the fun part because I got to know them and that was always good.

Speaker 4: (41:04)

And, and so many heavy hitting names and cutting edge music have performed at fresh sound concerts. Can you, can you remind us of some

Speaker 12: (41:13)

Joey Godrey who played solo bassoon and is now become well known? I had a lot of them before they were well-known Gian Riley, Mary Oliver, who is from San Diego, but now lives in Amsterdam. Um, Matt Welch who plays bagpipes, which was fun. Uh, Nelson, Alex climb.

Speaker 4: (41:37)

You have had Anthony Davis who won the Pulitzer for his central park five. He's been on our show as well. And your mentor, George Lewis.

Speaker 12: (41:48)

Well, he, he has been a good friend since 1993, since I went back to UC SD and the music department is a in quotes, older student, and he's remained a good friend, but he helped me get started. He had the first ideas of who should perform, and he just helped me along the way. And of course you perform there too.

Speaker 4: (42:14)

This kind of music is often difficult for people to understand or enjoy. Do you agree? It's an acquired taste. Yes.

Speaker 12: (42:22)

Yes. Because people like what's familiar and I never presented anything that was familiar because my whole idea, as I said before, was to open ears. You have to listen to everything because if you don't, how do you hear what you like? Some you won't like some you do, but you got to listen

Speaker 4: (42:46)

Ice. Would you give to someone, you know, who'd like to start maybe dipping a toe into cutting edge music. How should they start?

Speaker 12: (42:54)

I would say by listening to people like Carrie Riley, which is what I did and how I learned. And he did, uh, in C, which was very new back in those days.

Speaker 13: (43:07)

[inaudible]

Speaker 12: (43:26)

And then I, and I listened to him and then that moved me forward to Steve Reisch and Phillip glass and all kinds of other, uh, more contemporary composers.

Speaker 4: (43:37)

And what's next for you now?

Speaker 12: (43:39)

Oh, God, I wish I knew I have to find something that's for sure. I'm thinking maybe I could have some house concerts, so we'll see, I'm going to give myself a month or two, but then I'll start plotting at the next thing.

Speaker 4: (43:54)

So Bonnie what's on the program for the final fresh sound concert. This Friday,

Speaker 12: (43:59)

Steven Schick will be performing. He's playing music by Frederick Shefsky Vinco global car, Eric Griswold and Roger Reynolds.

Speaker 4: (44:12)

This Friday, the final fresh sound concert takes place at the San Diego dance theater at Liberty station. And the performer is Steven Schick, UC San Diego music professor who opened the fresh sound series. And now we'll close it out this Friday night. I've been speaking with Bonnie Wright creator of the fresh sound concert series, Bonnie. Thank you very much.

Speaker 12: (44:34)

You're very welcome. And thank you.