Censorship battles at libraries and a proposed national monument in the Imperial Valley

S1: This week on Kpbs roundtable , we discuss recent controversies involving San Diego libraries and censorship.

S2: Efforts to censor books. The availability of certain books in libraries has jumped dramatically.

S1: And we take a look at an effort to bring a national monument to the Imperial Valley after colonization.

S3: This land has actually really long served residents of color. The Imperial and Coachella Valleys are both home to many large Latino communities.

S1: That in our weekly roundup coming up next on roundtable. Few public spaces welcomed strangers quite like public libraries. Here's how Adrian Peterson from the Rancho Pena Nieto's library put it.

S4: You don't have to pay to come to the library. The library is here for everybody. It doesn't matter who you are , rich or poor , educated , whatever your religious beliefs are , we don't judge. We don't tell you what to read.

S1: But in recent years , libraries have faced controversies leading to protests and book bans , with some of them happening in and around San Diego. Kpbs Amita Sharma has been taking a closer look at libraries and how they've been impacted by recent cultural battles and divides. Amethyst , welcome back to roundtable.

S2: Oh , it's good to be here , Scott.

S1: So you've done some great reporting recently on libraries and their intersection with censorship and broader cultural battles.

S2: We didn't want to do your run of the mill Democracy Day story , how it started. You know why we why we mark it. So we ended up thinking we should do a story on how democracy is faring in San Diego County. Once we decided that , we had to figure out some yardsticks. How do we measure this ? So we arbitrarily picked these yardsticks. So we came up with threats to elected officials. Are they going up or are they going down ? We wanted to look at voting. We wanted to look at local news coverage , and we wanted to look at censorship. And where does censorship happen ? It happens at libraries.

S1: Well , let's jump in to Rancho Pena Nieto's library. Your latest story was was about some of the issues that are popping up here. What's been happening ? Catch us up.

S2: Well , last June during Pride month , two women checked out all the books at a pride display at Rancho Panaceas library. And then they sent an email to the library branch manager saying that , look , we've checked out all your books and we're not going to return them until you remove the display.

S1:

S2: But the public pulled the G move. I mean , they one upped these two women. They found out about it. I think there was some press coverage. And so they learned what books had been on the display , and they bought the books. People in droves , not just from Rancho Penas across the country , all over the world. They bought the books. They bought more books with LGBTQ themes , you know , to add to Rancho Mosquito's library collection on this topic. And they sent them. They gifted them to the library. Not only that , they ended up donating tens of thousands of dollars to the library.

S1: That's a lot of attention for , you know , a pretty small public library. You know , most people think of the job of librarian , you know , memorize the Dewey Decimal System , make some book recommendations. But the job of the librarian has evolved over time , especially in recent years. You know , tell us about how that's changed.

S2: I think that this is one of those rare situations where censorship is concerned , where attempted censorship is concerned , where they didn't have to handle it. They really didn't have to do anything. As soon as word got out , the public handled it. People handled it. They made their views known in a gigantic way about whether they will tolerate censorship , and they're not going to tolerate it. So I think the librarians unwittingly could basically just sit back and say , oh , okay. And in the end , you know , those two women , they returned those books.

S1: The situation in Rancho Dos is not unique , right ? It's happening in libraries across the country. You mentioned the pride display in Rancho Dos.

S2: There's a book called stamped from the beginning. Books on LGBTQ subjects also receive a lot of attention from parents , members of the community who think that not everybody should have access to that kind of material. There's a book called All Boys Aren't Blue , and you talked about censorship , you know , censorship across this country or efforts to censor books. The availability of certain books in libraries has jumped dramatically last year. In the first eight months , there were something like 700 challenges to 2000 books. That was a 20% jump over the previous year , 2022 , and that year there were record attempts at censorship.

S1: Let me ask you. So this this situation in Rancho Panofsky toss. It had the opposite effect. Like you said , a lot of times this the push to remove a book censor a book will have a whiplash in the other direction.

S2: That said , I mean , there's some funny instances that I've heard of where , you know , people will send these massive these messages to librarians saying , you know , why do you have this book ? Or they'll just go to the desk and ask them , why do you have this book ? Why is this necessary ? And some people will take the books and they'll hide them and we'll put them in other sections of the library , or they'll just put the books face down. It's kind of a little bit of passive aggressiveness. So people don't register their dissatisfaction with some of this material in the same way.

S1: Sort of guerilla efforts at censorship , I guess you could call.

S2: I knew that the library was the scene of this kind of activity.

S1: I want to step back a little bit.

S2: Between the Riverside Public Library , which was built in 1903 , the libraries at school K through 12 , and the UC Riverside Library. My mom was a grad student at UC Riverside. Between those three areas where I could tap into a library. I probably went to the library every single day when I was a child , so I'd say mostly in elementary school. And then , you know , in high school , I spent time in the school library , I think , pretty much every single day. Then in college , same thing after college , not so much. When I had my daughter. Then I was back at the library 2 or 3 times a week. In the course of this coverage , I've almost fallen in love with libraries all over again , and it's for that same reason that I think is very universal. It's the sense that you get when you go into a library. It's quiet , it's still there. All these books , there's a feeling of unlimited possibility of learning. And I was reading a little bit about Ben Franklin , who , with his friends back in 1731 , started the country's first library , and it started off with him. Well , him and his friends loved books , but books were so expensive. In fact , Ben Franklin stopped eating meat because meat was expensive. So he wanted to save money to buy books. He was eating lots of vegetables and lots of grains. And then he and his friends came up with this idea of pooling their money and buying the books that they wanted to read , and then starting a subscription service. And in order to subscribe to a book , in order to check out a book , you had to pay for the value of the book , and you wouldn't get your money until you'd returned your book.

S1: That's a pretty I actually didn't know that story. That's pretty amazing.

S2: It's fascinating. But it's that same thirst , you know , for knowledge that that drove him and his friends to do that. And I love the smell of libraries , you know. And it's almost the same in every library. Like you walk in and you think , yeah , this is where it happens.

S1: I think Yankee Candle needs to make a candle with the library. So I would buy it.

S2: I would too.

S1: I feel like you were giving a lot of love to , to some of the libraries that you went to growing up. I feel like I need to do the same. Shout out to , you know , Webster Public Library in West Hartford , Connecticut.

S5: Oh , wow. Library.

S1: Oh , wow. Yeah. Went there , especially in my , you know , in my later teen years. I went there a lot. Um , let's jump to another story related to libraries that you covered recently. You were reporting in recent weeks on a situation at the public library in Coronado.

S2: Uh , one is married to a current Navy Seal. Another one is married to a former Navy Seal. One of the women wanted to do her own story time , where she would choose books that were about Christmas from a religious perspective , and she also wanted to do military themed storytimes. She asked the library if she could do it , and they said , look , no , we have our library staff do this kind of storytime. And also we don't do storytimes that promote a particular religion. Another woman who I interviewed , Jessica Thompson , she's the one who's married to a former Navy Seal. She objected to a particular book that was read as storytime during Pride Month. It's called The Rainbow Parade , and she didn't like the illustrations in there. One of the illustrations showed two guys in Bdsm gear , and another one showed an illustration of , I think , a naked person walking down the street. So she thought , you know , this is inappropriate. And so she she said that she didn't want other books with any kind of graphic images being at eye level for toddlers in the library. She's not saying remove the books , she's saying put them in a place that's clearly delineated. So these women and the library couldn't come to any kind of agreement. They hired a lawyer. The lawyer sent a demand letter asking for certain things , certain policy changes that reflect what the women wanted. As of right now , this lawyer and the city of Coronado are in talks for potential policy changes. I believe I checked in maybe two days ago. They haven't reached any kind of agreement just yet.

S1: And so the multiple kind of threads here , you have the storytime issue related to religious stories being told. And then this issue of questions raised over content within books for children. But the situation kind of took a darker turn in recent months.

S2: It cast the library as this anti Christmas anti-military villain , and library staff were then inundated with messages that appeared to be coming from across the country. Because Fox News is national and some of the comments were hostile , they were vile and then some were threatening. So there was one comment just to give you a sample of of the tone , one comment that said woke liberals have the lowest intellect and common sense in society. They are perverted idiots who should not be permitted to live freely in our country. Do us all a favor and pull your head out of your woke. You know what and do the right thing. And then there were more , even more vile , but this time really alarming ones like this message that said , Will the staff please pour gasoline on their bodies and torch themselves ? Now , the key point about all of this I am told that these messages barely scratch the surface. I mean , they were really flooded with this kind of vitriol.

S1: And again , kind of going back to an idea that I raised earlier is we don't think of librarians as having to deal with these kinds of messages being on the front lines of this kind of , you know , vitriolic discourse. We expect them to be people who are members of our community , provide helpful resources. It's just so shocking that they have to deal with that kind of response. Discourse. Conversation is one thing. Debate is one thing. Those kinds of responses are a different thing altogether. Yeah.

S2: Yeah. I mean , it really sunk morale at at that library , as you can well understand. And one of the other things it prompted was the city ended up putting security cameras up outside the library because they were obviously worried about the hostility. But getting back to what you said about how the job of libraries or librarians has evolved over the years , you know , I think at their core , the function is the same. I mean , librarians are very knowledgeable. They love books , they love information , and they love helping people discover new worlds of information. But librarians have had to absorb some of society's ills that have developed over the last few decades. And you'll see so many homeless people go into libraries and spend time there. They'll have a few hours of a safe place to be. It's warm , it's comfortable , and you know it gives them a little bit of an opportunity to do something that they might find enriching. There's so many kids who come from homes where mom and dad work , and they may not be able to afford child care or after school activities. And so the libraries become the defacto child care facility for so many kids. And I think that's important to know that these places are so much more than channels for information. One more example I want to give you , and that is , as you and I have discussed in the newsroom , we're in the midst of a loneliness epidemic. And many elderly people suffer from this , suffer from loneliness. And so a lot of times , people who go to the library and interact with other patrons or librarians , those are the only people that they might interact with that day or that week. And that says a lot.

S1: It says a lot about how these libraries are cornerstone of the community cornerstone , a cornerstone of the social fabric of , you know , of our communities. Taking a step back where we started with this was , you know , you were talking about the Democracy Day , the role of libraries and democracy and the role of , you know , the impact of censorship.

S2: I say that because the core principles that form the bedrock of libraries are the same core principles that form the bedrock of democracy freedom of thought , freedom of speech , access to information , inclusivity. The library , as Adrian Peterson said at the start of our conversation , is for everyone. Just as democracy is.

S1: Amita , thanks so much for being here.

S2: Thanks for having me.

S1: When we come back , we turn our focus to the Imperial Valley in an effort to create a national monument.

S3: I mean , I think you have to start at the beginning. This is all ancestral land of North American indigenous peoples.

S1: That's just ahead on Round Table. Welcome back to Kpbs roundtable. I'm Scott Rod. To the east of San Diego lies the Imperial Valley. It's an expansive land known for its agriculture , its connection to Mexico to the south , and the Salton Sea of movement is underway to turn part of the Imperial Valley into a national monument. It's an effort to protect a vulnerable desert ecosystem , as well as to allow its residents to spend more time in nature. Kpbs reporter Corey Suzuki has been reporting on the Imperial Valley and joins us now. Corey , welcome to roundtable.

S3: Hi , Scott. Thanks for having me.

S1: So your recent story from the Imperial Valley is ostensibly about the Chuck Walla and an effort to establish a national monument that would protect hundreds of thousands of acres of federally owned land.

S3: Well , a Chuck Walla is a desert lizard found in Southern California , other parts of the southwestern United States , and northern Mexico. I've never seen one in person. They're apparently pretty large. They're one of the largest lizards native to North America , and they're also pretty common. There's there's a lot of habitat where they live , and they're not considered an endangered species or anything like that at this point. But this species is really coming up because there's this coalition of environmental organizations and tribes that's based in the Imperial Coachella Valley region that are proposing this new national monument. It's on the border of Imperial and Riverside County , and a national monument is a big chunk of protected public land. It's kind of like a national park , although there are some slight differences. National monuments are typically shielded from mining and drilling , and they can also open the door for the federal government and tribes to work together to manage the land. And this coalition , working on the specific proposal , has suggested that they take the name of this lizard and call it the Chocolate National Monument.

S1: So I said your reporting was ostensibly about the charcoal , and it is , but the proposed monument has greater significance than that.

S3: A whole bunch of groups are supporting the proposed monument. There are some really big national names like the Sierra Club , the Audubon Society , and the center for Biological Diversity. You often see those groups supporting movements like this to protect wildlife and natural ecosystems. They're kind of some of the usual suspects , but this coalition is really big , and it ranges from both national organizations to local ones. There are groups like the Consejo de Federation's Mexicanos , the Council of Mexican Federations in North America , which works to empower Latino immigrant communities in the US and Mexico. There's Latino outdoors. Their mission is to make nature as safe and inclusive place for Latino communities. And then there are a number of tribal governments supporting this proposal , including the Fort Yuma Kitsune Indian Tribe and the 29 Palms Band of Mission Indians. And then to understand , I think , why this land is so significant to the people who live nearby. I mean , I think you have to start at the beginning. This is all ancestral land of North American indigenous peoples in the Imperial Valley. That includes the Kumeyaay and Kitsune people. And the land was stolen and colonized first by Spanish missionaries and then by the Mexican government in the mid 1800s , and then later by gold rush settlers and farmers. And so the land still has a lot of cultural and physical meaning to the tribes that still live in the valley , and a monument declaration could actually make a really big difference specifically in on on that front , because the Biden administration has been making this really big push to work together with tribes on managing public lands , Biden's Interior Secretary , Deb Haaland , has really made it a priority to reach some more of these agreements , which basically return some control of these ancestral lands to these tribes , and the chuckwagon monument could open the door for more agreements like that with local tribes in the Salton Sea area. And then related to that , the desert is also home to a lot of biodiversity , a lot of plants and animals and ecosystems. One supporter told me that people think of deserts is pretty lifeless , but in a lot of cases , she said , that's really not true at all. There's a lot of life happening. It's just kind of harder to see in this area. Specifically , there are sheep and foxes and all kinds of different plants and insects , and that's important partly because biodiversity is crashing globally because of land use and environmental pollution and climate change , and that has all kinds of other cascading effect. So I think supporters would say it's essential to protect biodiversity where we can.

S1: Clearly there are a lot of issues wrapped up in this , and you just illuminated a lot of them in there. It seems like so many entry points into , you know , why supporters may come behind this proposal and want to see this national monument.

S3: A manager for Quofem Consejo Federacion Mexicanos , and she grew up in the Coachella Valley. So this is really , I think , a very personal place for her. And that was what she said to me was that this campaign , it felt very close to home because what it was about was protecting areas where she and her , her family and her friends were able to go and spend time and , um , and to really connect with the place and the , the wildlife around them. And I think what she would say is that it really brought the conservation movement into a really personal light for her. Yeah.

S1: Yeah. I mean , when you talk about some of these bigger groups that support it , they have a lot of power to move these things forward. But hearing those personal stories of how people who lived in these areas interacted with the land is always so enlightening and very enriching.

S3: Even after colonization. This land has actually really long served residents of color. The Imperial and Coachella Valleys are both home to many large Latino communities. 85% of people in Imperial County actually identify as Latino , so it shouldn't really be surprising that there are lots of people of color who are accessing this land. But historically , discriminatory laws and racial violence have really cut off a lot of communities of color black , Asian and Latino communities from natural areas , and instead , in a lot of cases , really concentrated environmental hazards in their neighborhoods instead. And so that has really left , I think , the the movement to enjoy nature and wildlife , the um , the conservation movement that's really led that to to be largely focused on the priorities of white Americans and largely something that's enjoyed and led by white Americans. And so , to me , that makes this land in this proposal even more special , because the land that is covered in this proposal , that charcoal and national monument proposal has been enjoyed by people of color for a long time. In the 1990s , the Federal Bureau of Land Management did a study of the Mecca Hills Preserve , for example , which is part of the proposed monument on the north edge of the Salton Sea. And it found that more than three quarters of visitors on holiday weekends identified as Latino there. So , um , that was that was more than 20 years ago.

S1: Yeah , that's pretty amazing. I mean , obviously that hearing about the long arc of this development and how I mean , you talked about going back centuries , but even in the last few decades , I mean , that's pretty that's pretty interesting for this story , you were able to go up in a Cessna small plane alongside some advocates who are , you know , pushing for this monument to become a reality. What struck you about the land when you were able to go up in that plane ? Uh , you know , obviously when you're up there looks quite a bit different than when you're down on the ground.

S3: It was really the scale that struck me. This is a truly massive proposal. Hundreds of thousands of acres of land. There are lots of different trails , different landscapes , hills , mountains , canyons , deserts. It was really beautiful. As we flew overhead , the the light was kind of hazy , um , even though the sun was high. And so everything was really lighting up. You could see like the grooves and the land and the ridges and the peaks and the kind of , um , historical trails that have been used by the tribes that have steward that stewarded the land. And something else that also came up was the really stark difference between the land itself and the farmland that borders it. I mean , the Imperial Valley and parts of the Coachella Valley are very engineered places now. They basically take in these dusty desert areas and turn them into , um , this vibrant green farmland by tapping into the Colorado River to the east. And so when you fly over , you see this really sharp contrast between these hills and mountains and kind of rolling canyons , um , and this like , sort of jagged , high desert landscape. And then all of a sudden it becomes this patchwork of , of green and blue and farmland that I think anybody who , who has ever lived or driven through farm country would be familiar with , um , but it's a it's a really sharp transition. It happens like , like that.

S1:

S3: It could either happen through an act of Congress , uh , which which could set aside the public , those public lands , or it could happen through a presidential executive order , which is sort of one of the things that is slightly unique to a national monument. That's kind of the the common way that a national monument is created through an executive order under something called the Antiquities Act. Now , the white House hasn't really said much on whether. Biden has his eye on this proposal in particular , but this whole push for the national monument has been getting a lot of traction. There have been a bunch of calls for this from local cities and officials , and all the way up to the House of Representatives , where there has been some motion in Congress. US Representative Raul Ruiz , who represents Palm Desert in Riverside County , has introduced a law that could make this monument real. It's still in very early stages , and supporters are actually right now more hopeful about an executive order just because of how slowly Congress moves right now. But this is being considered at the federal level. It's things are things are in a bit of a holding pattern , but there are also things in motion that could that could make this monument a reality.

S1: Corey Suzuki covers the Imperial Valley as well as the South Bay for Kpbs. Corey , thanks for being here.

S3: Thanks so much , Scott.

S1: When we come back , we'll discuss some more stories that got her attention on this week's roundup. That's next on Round Table. Welcome back to roundtable. It's time now for our weekly roundup of stories we've been following. Joining me is Andrew Bracken.

S6: Pretty good.

S1: All right.

S6: And kind of as they talked about in that conversation , we have been seeing a lot more effects of that and migrants being dropped off at the transportation centers like we saw before. This Migrant Welcome Center opened. The San Diego County Board of Supervisors has , you know , at least taken action to develop a migrant transfer site and shelter sometime in the future. I think the the funding is not there. I think the funding is supposed to be coming from the federal government , so there's potentially some planning there to help with those arriving migrants. And then one other kind of note on this sort of border front is the US. Alexandra Mendoza and Teri Figueroa reported on another death from a fall from the border fence. And that's something that Gustavo has also covered quite a bit. The rise in injuries and the rise in more serious injuries as the border fence wall has gotten higher over the past couple of years. But yes , earlier this week on Tuesday , a Mexican man died from a fall off the border wall.

S1: And Gustavo is reporting on. That has been really stellar for me. It was eye opening to learn just how much those injuries have not only increased in number , but as you said , increase in severity. Uh , seeing his reporting develop on that has been really important in terms of just looking at , you know , a wall is not just a wall. There is a human toll to it.

S6: Yeah , exactly. And the one from one of his stories , I remember a doctor that served patients there kind of made it describe like that the injuries they were then seeing were more like car accident injuries , rather than something you'd expect from someone falling off a fence. Yeah , I agree , it's really kind of brings it home and has human impact , like you said. All right.

S1:

S6: This is S.E. Baradar who attended the protest.

S7: I have heard what they do. They don't do anything for San Diego. They only profit , profit , profit.

S6: So , you know , I don't think this is breaking news for San Diegans. But we you know , we all know that electricity prices are amongst the highest in the nation. And I think this just is just seeing like a reaction to the profits that Sempra which owns Sydney , it gets always a big response when we hear about these profits. And this was $23 million more than last year's profits. So it's just getting a lot of attention and push back I think. Absolutely.

S1: Absolutely. I mean people are seeing their electricity bills go up. There have been talks about and we've talked about this before , the potential fixed rate charge that could be tacked on to some people's electricity bills. And so they're saying , okay , you know , this company , are they hurting ? It doesn't look like it. Clearly if they're making this sort of profit. So when people see that profit and try to square it with how their energy bills have gone up , I think it's a head scratcher for a lot of people in San Diego. Yeah.

S6: Yeah. And I think we'll kind of have to dig into this more. And , you know , hopefully we can have Eric on roundtable again soon to talk more about the pricing changes potentially. And yeah , what's behind the finances here.

S1: All right. So surging electricity prices where else are prices surging.

S6: Well so this was a story that , you know , it's not a San Diego story specifically , but a story from the Associated Press is where I saw it. But this effort that fast food giant Wendy's was taking to implement the surge pricing. And I think we're familiar with that. Anybody that's written in an Uber Lyft , you know , some time you'll check a ride and it'll be $15. And then ten minutes later it'll be up to $45. The surge pricing kind of changes based on demand. Well , the CEO of Wendy's kind of made this announcement that they were going to try to start experimenting with this idea of surge pricing as early as next year , as well as some other kind of , you know , technical advancements. But it sounds like that may not be happening now.

S1: I think there was quite a bit of backlash to this. I mean , this my understanding was discussed by the CEO of Wendy's. And , you know , the public heard about this and , you know , just kind of flipped out , I think , or at least a lot of people had some strong takes about , you know , walking into a Wendy's and I guess seeing some sort of digital forward , showing that a burger could be jumping up or down , depending on demand , is is that really what we need ? What is your take on this ? Let me.

S6: I just think it's interesting , this surge pricing , we've become used to it in certain aspects , like the Uber and Lyft thing , which can vary quite a bit. And also like tickets , I don't know if you've ever seen it with ticket prices or going to sporting event. It varies wildly. I think it's hilarious because yeah , people were just like putting up , you know , memes about hamburger prices and stuff in retaliation to this. But I do expect to see more of these experiments in other sort of ways , products and stuff. I'm not shocked by it , I guess.

S1: Well , I think if they're going to do it , I think they should go all in , like make this like the trading floor on the New York Stock Exchange. Like , I want to be able to walk into a Wendy's and like , short the nuggets and see the price drop for like a ten piece and , uh , you know , make , uh , make a healthy sum from it. I want to be able to tell my kid in the future that I paid for his college because I timed the Baconator market right.

S6: I definitely have now. I'm like having memories of trying to time an Uber ride and being like , oh , if I order it right now , or should I wait ? Will it go down ? I mean , I definitely like played with that over a period of minutes. I don't know how much money I've saved , but it is a weird concept. So , you know , it's nice to hear that they're maybe backing off that for now at least.

S1: We'll see if they return to it. I'm going to stick with the fast food theme. There's been a lot of noise out of Sacramento in recent days about the fast food law that's about to go into effect , that will raise the minimum wage for fast food workers. And it's not so much the law itself that's been getting attention , but a report from Bloomberg that highlighted the fact that restaurants that bake their own bread will be exempt from it. And that includes restaurants like Panera Bread in Bloomberg , found that one close associate of Governor Gavin Newsom , who has donated over $150,000 to Newsom's campaigns in recent years , owns two dozen Panera Breads , and the reporting from Bloomberg has suggested that there may have been some influence from this associate on this little carve out. And so , I don't know , I saw this and I said , man , you know , it should be noted. Newsom's office has said that , you know , there's been nothing wrong here. There's been been no wrongdoing. And there was a lot of negotiations happening with this , with this law. But it does go to show. I mean , this is something that I think a lot of people will look at and say , you know , even if there's no wrongdoing here , people have questions about it.

S6: One of my memories is that over the pandemic , the The French Laundry incident that I think got a lot of attention because I believe he was eating with some lobbyists , correct ? Yes. I mean , so it'll be interesting to see where it goes. And you know how the governor responds. I think my question would be more to you. I mean , you covered state politics. You covered the governor quite a bit. What would be your first question to him in the next press conference , if you were still up in Sacramento covering that.

S1: What conversations was he having with this associate while this law was being hammered out ? When the when the negotiations were happening , what sort of , uh , conversations did you have with this person ? And I will note , I covered stories very closely related to this type of thing when I was in Sacramento , you know , during Covid , I had a whole series of stories that looked at how Newsom's office had awarded no bid contracts to large companies , mostly health care companies , uh , at a time when we were in emergency and they needed to get contracts out quickly to get things like vaccines and tests , etc.. But I took a look at those contracts and found that some of the big dollar contracts overlapped with big dollar contributors to Newsom and Newsom's campaigns , and those contributions were coming both before and after the contracts are being handed out. And again , Newsom's office said , look , there's there's nothing there's no wrongdoing here. And experts I spoke to said , look , there is no indication that any laws have been broken. It does raise questions for voters about , you know , the integrity of their politicians , their elected officials. So this is something where I've seen a bit of a pattern of this , where people are raising questions around who's getting what treatment in Sacramento. All right , let's jump to the next story. Now , what else are you following , Andrew ? Anything else on your reading list this week.

S6: In a little bit lighter ? Note this bioluminescence that sometimes comes in our coast that you can see at night , certain beaches that's been cited over the last few nights , so that might be worth checking out this weekend. Um , there have been sightings at Torrey Pines in Carlsbad , mission Bay , I think , as well. And that's , you know , happens a couple times a year here in San Diego. I don't know if you've seen it , but , you know , these like batches of plankton kind of mixed with the waves. And it kind of adds this cool , colorful effect. So it's worth checking out.

S1: Oh it's awesome. Yeah , I've seen it. I live in. Suffolk Beach and it's remarkable. I didn't quite know what it what the science behind it when I first saw it. And as I learned more like you said , the the plankton that causes it. It's fascinating , but it is really cool to check out. Definitely recommend , um , going down there all rounded out with , uh , a story that really caught my attention this week was from NPR. It was a pretty wild investigation. The headline is A tech billionaire is quietly buying up land in Hawaii. No one knows why. And that billionaire is Marc Benioff. He's the owner of Salesforce. He's been buying up a ton of land on Hawaii around Waimea. And a reporter from NPR got in touch with Benioff , and they had some interviews , some conversations. A lot of this land purchase was anonymous , you know , Benioff said he didn't want attention. He touted a lot of the philanthropy that he had done around the island. And , you know , he has done a lot and he's donated a lot of this land. But as the reporter kept digging and found some holding companies , that's when this story got kind of dark. And Benioff had said he was tracking the reporter in one of their exchanges. He knew exactly where she was , and he said , basically , it's my job to track you. And he started prodding other NPR reporters and the NPR CEO for more Intel. And it just really struck me , as you know , this was beyond just a story looking into who owns or who's buying up a lot of land in a place. But the response that someone so powerful would have to this type of reporting and someone just asking questions.

S6: This is pretty disturbing. I didn't know about this , especially the sort of tracking of the reporter. Has there been a response from Benioff ? You know , there.

S1: Was a lot of , uh , a lot of the responses of Benioff in terms of the purchasing of the land and the story itself. There was follow up coverage of this story. I've not seen any comment specifically from Benioff about that aspect of it. But again , you know , Benioff camp has said a lot of this land purchases for good reason. You know , it's for philanthropic purposes. A lot of it will also be used for their family. They they said they like their privacy. But yeah , that tracking aspect of it , the kind of , um , I don't know , uh , menacing aspect of approaching or trying to confront a reporter in that way when they're simply just trying to figure out what a situation is. Yeah , it gives me goosebumps.

S6: Yeah , that's definitely disturbing. I mean , in another way , it does remind me of this , these land purchases that are going on in a part of Northern California , probably closer to where. Yeah , just.

S1: Outside of the Bay area. Yeah.

S6: Yeah. And I think it was , you know , Marc Andreessen or maybe it's not even clear , but some very wealthy tech folks from the Bay area are kind of potentially looking to build a city from scratch was the sort of the what I understood. Yeah.

S1: Yeah. They were buying up a lot of land around Travis Air Base , and it was Marc Andreessen and some others as well , some other investors , and it raised a lot of concern because at first there was just an LLC that was behind the purchases , and there was a lot of concern about who may be purchasing all this land around this airbase. And there was concern that it might have been , um , you know , a foreign country or someone who didn't have the best interests of the United States in mind. And after some reporting , I believe it was the New York Times that uncovered that. It was , in fact , an LLC that was led by these , you know , these sort of tech titans. But their plan is to try to essentially build a utopian sort of city from scratch. And they're trying to put this on the ballot. And from what I can tell , voters are a bit hesitant about it. You know , there is a big pitch here. The idea of trying to build a city from scratch in a place like California is such a tall order and so many unknowns , so many regulations. But it does speak to , I mean , when there are these purchases , mass purchase of land by kind of unknown folks , and even when it becomes clear from wealthy folks , yeah , it leaves people a bit unnerved. Yeah.

S6: Yeah. And just the amount of power , the amount of money we're talking about is , I don't know , it's it's like it's even hard to relate to. I mean , I guess it it makes , in some ways Mark Zuckerberg attending a UFC fight look a little tame by comparison. I don't know if you saw that. I did , yeah.

S1: But on the Hawaii front , I'm sure there will be follow up reporting on not only what happens with that land , but , you know , response to and from Marc Benioff. So I'll definitely be keeping an eye on that that investigation on npr.org. Definitely worth checking out. Andrew Bracken , thanks for being here and for joining me on the roundup.

S6: Thanks , Scott.

S1: Thanks for tuning in to Kpbs roundtable. We'd love to hear from you. You can email us at roundtable at pbs.org , or leave us a message at (619) 452-0228. You can also listen to our show anytime as a podcast. Kpbs roundtable airs on Kpbs FM at noon on Fridays and again Sundays at 6 a.m.. Roundtable is produced by Andrew Bracken. Brandon Truitt is our technical producer. Brooke Ruth is our senior producer , and I'm Scott Rodd. Thanks for listening.