Ringing In New Year's Eve While Practicing Sobriety

MAUREEN CAVANAUGH: Our top story on Midday Edition, we're heading into the final days of the holiday season, the last parties and celebrations. Do you plan to take it easy and stop overindulging as we approach the new year? Or are you ready for that last blowout, eat and drink, indulge your habits until your New Year's resolution kicks in? This can be a crazy, difficult time of year for people who are dealing with addictions and for those already in recovery. Joining us to talk about those challenges are my guests, Jeanne McAlister. She's founder and CEO of the McAlister Institute. It's one of San Diego's largest alcohol and drug treatment providers and she herself is a recovering alcoholic. Jeanne, welcome to the show. JEANNE McALISTER: Thank you very much and thank you for having me. MAUREEN CAVANAUGH: Dr. Anthony Jensen is chief medical officer of mental health systems. That's a nonprofit providing mental health and drug and alcohol rehabilitation services in San Diego to those on Medi-Cal and the uninsured. Dr. Jensen, welcome. ANTHONY JENSEN: thank you. Thank you for having me. MAUREEN CAVANAUGH: Let me start with you Dr. Jensen. It may seem obvious but can you explain why this in particular is a challenging time of year for people trying to maintain sobriety. After all there are parties and celebrations and happy hours all through the year. ANTHONY JENSEN: Right, well the holidays can be a series of highs and lows for most people. There are a lot of expectations, a lot of commitments that people make and things like that and high expectations that it sometimes can lead to disappointment. For people in recovery those challenges can be quite great. If they are trying to stay in sobriety there may be events that they are expected to go to you know, family members or friends would like them to be there and there may be substances being used, alcohol. Might be part of the celebrations. Sometimes those can trigger you know, cravings and things like that. Or they may have feelings of sadness related to you know, passed over indulgences that led to family problems and things like that. Those can be triggered reminders as well. MAUREEN CAVANAUGH: So Dr. Jensen I guess is telling us that everything is at a higher pitch. It's all exaggerated during the holidays do you find that as well? JEANNE McALISTER: Absolutely and I think that there's just so much stress connected with like shopping, family events, having to go to parties, Christmas parties, company parties. Those sort of things. And if a person is new in recovery that's a really difficult time because a lot of them if they are new in recovery they are estranged from their family so they want to be with their family so they are very sad about that. MAUREEN CAVANAUGH: Now you have been sober for many years, Jeanne, but where the holidays a tough time for you when you were new in recovery? JEANNE McALISTER: Absolutely I didn't know what to do. Because the usual thing was to go to a bar and get as drunk as I could to forget and not know what I'd done and then my family didn't believe me for about six years and my recovery that I was not going to go out and be a jerk again. MAUREEN CAVANAUGH: So they were keeping you at arms distance. JEANNE McALISTER: They were keeping me at arms distance and the other thing is when you are new in recovery and you're trying to reunite with your family they will do things like not drink in front of you because they are afraid that you're going to go off. And I think treating us like we are abnormal is probably a bad thing for us because it triggers that oh, I am. You know, that. What I would like to encourage people to do if they are around people in recovery is abnormal, not ridicule people that do not drink because that's the other thing. Oh, what's wrong with you, you can't have a drink, just have one little one. There's something wrong with you because you do not drink. And one of the things that I found utterly in recovery was that there's a lot of people out there that do not drink, period. MAUREEN CAVANAUGH:at all, never have. JEANNE McALISTER: Yeah, so why make fun of those people because they are as normal as somebody in recovery. MAUREEN CAVANAUGH: Dr. Jensen, do you see a lot of relapses during this time of year? ANTHONY JENSEN: Yes, it can certainly be a time where, it can be quite a stress especially people new in recovery who have not, you know, been through a few seasons like this where they have been able to develop new traditions, new memories, or maybe they have, they are isolated from their support system as Jeanne said. They are especially vulnerable. So yes, there can definitely be an increase in people who are relapsing during this period. MAUREEN CAVANAUGH: And how do you handle that I mean if somebody contacts you and they are really horribly upset that they have not been able to face this challenge and they have relapse. What do you say to them? ANTHONY JENSEN: It is important to remember that addiction is a chronic condition and much like any chronic condition like let's say a medical condition like diabetes, they're a part of the condition are times to have a relapse or to have you know, an increase in problems. And the thing to do is to move forward from that. To, you know, examine the support you are getting, get back into your recovery plan, seek out more support or readjust what you're doing to keep yourself in recovery. Not to look at it as a failure. Look at it as part of the recovery process. MAUREEN CAVANAUGH: In your years, in your drinking years, Jeanne, you talk about the vicious circle that using alcohol creates. You drink because you are depressed or sad and you are depressed because you drink too much. JEANNE McALISTER: Right. I don't think everybody recognizes what alcohol does to you and that is if you start at a low level of depression and then you drink, you will go up for a while and then when you come back down you are twice as depressed as you were when you began. And that's just a physical thing. And I think Tony brought up some really good things about the fact that people that are really in recovery should have the support system. Not be alone. I don't trust my head still to this day. I always want to have somebody with me that supports my recovery. There's a lot of nondrinking social events around town that you need to make yourself aware of that you can go to. I think we used to have sober first night downtown and that was a lot of fun and everybody there was family and everybody there was having a good time. And I think that's the other thing is that you have to remember that you can still have a good time at Christmas time or holiday time without drinking. MAUREEN CAVANAUGH: I want to bring up a controversial subject there seems to be differing medical opinions about whether people who used to drink too much can safely have one drink. Or if they can safely toast in the new year. I have read a different amount, different medical opinions about that. What is your opinion, let me start with you, Jeanne. JEANNE McALISTER: Absolutely not. Think of the lifetime way of living and abstinence is very very important. I don't know, maybe that's true, but why? Why try one drink because for me for me I can even handle one Reese's peanut butter cup. You know. MAUREEN CAVANAUGH: One potato chip kind of gal. JEANNE McALISTER: If I eat one I'm going to do 10, so why do it with alcohol? I think alcohol is very cunning baffling and powerful that's my belief and I just want to stay away from it and I always like to tell a story about having 52 years of being clean and sober. I have poker parties and people bring alcohol and put it in my refrigerator so I don't notice it, but one day I'm by myself in my house I open up the refrigerator door and there I see some beer and I say I wonder what it tastes like. Who would know if I had a drink. You know it darn well you have not forgotten what it tastes like, but what I'm saying is that is the monkey on your back, that's 52 years without having a drink that it comes to me that maybe I could try it. But I'm too afraid to tell you the truth. My drinking was so horrible. I'm so happy to be out of that black pit, to have you know, to be out of that kind of depression you couldn't give me a pill and tell me I could drink because I don't see any benefit to it. It's not even good for your body. MAUREEN CAVANAUGH: Now Dr. Jensen, is that your opinion as well? ANTHONY JENSEN: I think we have to recognize that addiction is a complex phenomenon. It involves biology, environment and timing. Timing by stage of development that you are in. It's not simply a matter of being able to choose or not to choose or being weak willed or not or having a stronger will. It has it is these things coming together that actually changes not only your psyche and mind about using a substance and your, you know there are triggers in your reward system and neurotransmitter changes and things like that. So that for someone who has an addiction you know, making a choice like that can be quite a challenge because there's also biological factors involved in driving you to relapse and become engaged at the same level that you had used years later as Jeanne said, 52 years. But it's possible for some people you know, who could end up right at the level they were. Many many years ago because of that biology that is there. So it can be a very dangerous thing. You have to be very careful. MAUREEN CAVANAUGH: Will there, at this time of year you hear a lot of people say you not going on a diet in January I will stop smoking in January I will cut down on my bad habits in January, even I'm going to get sober this year, this is my resolution. And then, until January, anything goes. You know, just eating and smoking and drinking like crazy. Does that kind of a blowout make it harder to keep your resolution, when January does actually dawn? ANTHONY JENSEN: Yeah because you know, it's really an unattainable goal that you could do things to overindulge to that extreme and then get right back on track. And that's, I think that's true for all of us I think we all have that challenge like jeans that I know I like Christmas cookies and it is hard to go back to eating the right thing when you have really exploded on what you are doing. But if you think about that in someone who already has issues with you know, addiction like I said, the biology and environment, metal reasoning associated with addiction it can be really hard to come back from that. MAUREEN CAVANAUGH: Do you see, Jeanne, a surge in new patients at your establishment in January, I mean is this a New Year's resolution kind of thing? JEANNE McALISTER: I think the holiday time, it probably starts about two weeks before Christmas. That we see a lot of people that want to come in and do something about and get better, or get warm. I don't know. Because sometimes it's just really cold out there, or change their lives. So it's through the holiday season that we do see this surge of people coming in. ANTHONY JENSEN: I think some of it to is there are people that are reminded of bad experiences they had again because for most people at the time when you get together with family and support and friends who rally together for people who had troubles with overuse of substances those can be bad memories because they might remind them again of a bad experience they had a holiday that started with a couple of drinks and ended with everyone fighting and being at odds. MAUREEN CAVANAUGH: what is the probability of people going in and saying they want to change their lives and stop drinking. Do we have statistics on how many people will go in and say they want to do that that actually are successful, Jeanne? JEANNE McALISTER: I think that we do on a short-term basis probably for about a year I think it's around 35% of the people that actually make it. The first time. Because sometimes it takes more than once, one episode of treatment to get it. And I think some of the programs that we have out there that are insisting that people go in for treatment are really healthy and help people because then they have the leverage and we need leverage sometimes. We need a reason like I got sober for my daughter, I didn't get sober for myself. She was my leverage and I wanted to keep her. Yes. MAUREEN CAVANAUGH: I have to end it here but I have to ask you where people can go, how can they reach out if they are looking to stay sober during the holidays, during New Year's Eve? ANTHONY JENSEN: Well people can refer or family members can refer themselves to our agency, mental health systems and I know you will have that on your website. We have a website and they can call our organization here in San Diego as well as Jeanne's organization, the McAllister Institute. JEANNE McALISTER: And 211 is a great resource for people that need help. ANTHONY JENSEN: Right, that's nonemergency or the County, in an emergency crisis situation the San Diego County behavioral health services has an accident and crisis line and it's 24 hours. MAUREEN CAVANAUGH: I only have time to give out one so I have time to give a that the other numbers are on the website a KPBS.org the County crisis line is 1-888-724-7240. I've been speaking with Jeanne McAlister founder and CEO of the McAlister Institute and Dr. Anthony Jensen, chief medical officer at mental health systems thank you both very much. BOTH: Thank you