S1: It's time for Midday Edition on Kpbs. Today , we're revisiting the second part of our conversation on menopause , where we answer questions from listeners. I'm Jade Hindman. Here's to conversations that keep you informed and inspired and make you think. We asked you how menopause is affecting your life and you told us , I.
S2: Am definitely battling the symptoms of menopause. And I'm looking for some alternative solutions that possibly don't involve hormones , you know , beyond what my doctor might be recommending for me.
S1: We'll have an answer to that question and more. Plus , the push for menopause leave as an employee benefit. That's ahead on Midday Edition. Joining us to answer your questions about menopause is Dr. Cynthia Dunkel , a professor at the UC San Diego School of Medicine , and Jill Wood , who teaches women's gender and sexuality studies at Penn State University. And a note to our listeners. This show deals with mature subjects and may not be suitable for children. Also , any advice is for information and education only. It is not a substitute for medical advice from your health care provider. Here's our first audience question. Take a listen.
S2: My name is Kristen. I am from West LA. I am 52 years old. And my question is , I am definitely battling the symptoms of menopause and I'm looking for some alternative solutions that possibly don't involve hormones , you know , beyond what my doctor might be recommending for me. So some things I can do on my own that would make me feel better and like myself again.
S1: Something so many people want to get back to.
S3: Dr. Dunkel Yeah , it's it's kind of interesting when we look at the list of alternatives , we've been talking about some prescription therapies , but two things that really struck me when the North and North American Menopause Society looked at this a few years ago was the number one most effective alternative option was cognitive behavioral therapy , which is kind of a way that affects sort of our mindfulness and our thinking and you don't just go out and , you know , read a book or do this on your own , but there are practitioners for this and it can be very helpful. The second one on the list that also surprised me was hypnosis , right ? I mean , but it but it in clinical trials was very effective. So these are two opportunities to be kind of mind body approaches that don't involve prescription drugs , don't involve hormones and yet can be very effective for women. The other things that were looked at and some of the studies that Dr. Lacroix did with the flash studies were things like exercise. No one can argue that exercise is good for you , but exercise is not going to help your hot flashes necessarily. What it might do is help with some of this shifting and body weight that some women experience. It can help with from a from your metabolism standpoint , with your cholesterol levels , your blood sugar levels , your blood pressure levels , all important things that we know can be made better. And similarly , yoga. And when the investigators wrote about this , they said , well , yoga makes women feel so well that they might still have hot flashes , but they just stopped caring. So I think , you know , depending where you feel in kind of the spectrum , again , think you can find something that will help you without hormones and without prescription medications.
S1: All right. Here's another hormone related question from an audience member. Take a listen.
S3: Hi , I'm Kathy and I live in San Diego. My mom had had breast cancer. She was adamant that I'm not ever , ever take hormones. And so I didn't. And I got through it pretty well. However , fast forward 15 years and I developed a lot of urinary tract infections , a lot of cystitis , and I had no idea that that would be a problem. So our low dose hormones , a good way to treat postmenopausal cystitis. Yes. So post-menopausal cystitis would infer that there was repeated infections or inflammation of the bladder , as with cystitis means. And there have been some good studies to suggest that women with recurrent urinary tract infections can benefit from estrogen therapy. And having said that , I would say that , you know , after all the other things that your doctor might consider in the way of urine cultures and evaluation of the bladder and things like that. So but think what can get kind of confusing sometimes is we know that over time , although it may take a while , the vast majority of women will stop having hot flashes. But over time , for the vast majority of women , vaginal and urinary symptoms will just get worse. So if the hot flushes go away on their own , these symptoms won't. And so some women find that if they just use a vaginal moisturizer or a lubricant over the counter preparations , that that can help. For example , your concern was with cystitis. But some women have more concerns with discomfort with intercourse or discomfort with sex. And so they can start with that. But if they're being pretty faithful about using it and it's still not helping , they might want to think about applications of vaginal estrogen products and again , might not work for everyone. But there are a spectrum of options. There are creams , there are rings , there are tablets. There's something else called an insert. And the good news is that these doses that are currently recommended. Are so low that if we did a blood test on you before you use these and afterwards , we do not see a bump in your serum estrogen level so that this is really being directed at the vagina and that it turns out that the lower part of the urinary tract system , the urethra , is also sensitive to estrogen so women can get some real relief from considering that as a possible help.
S1: And another question here from Priscilla.
S4: And I'll say that a lot of the research has found that really the context of someone's relationship and someone's life is often more important than hormone levels. So what I mean by that is a few things. First , the way we tend to think about sex is as penetrative vaginal penile sex and the way we kind of conceptualize sex as when it starts and ends is sex typically starts with a male erection and sex ends with a male ejaculating. And so this really male paradigm of sex doesn't always work out that well for women. And this is especially true during the menopausal transition and after when the vagina just needs a little more care and thoughtfulness. And so I mentioned earlier this term vaginal apathy. And if I had a magic wand , I would wave that term out of existence , because really it's referring to that the vagina , the walls of the vagina thin , and they become more sensitive. And so for me , the experience of vaginal dryness , I'm going to , I guess , tell everyone about my vaginal dryness is that I think dryness was not a good term. It is a very it's very uncomfortable and itchy. And I would be running and feel like I wanted to rip my vagina off. And so , of course , I don't want to have sex if I'm feeling really like , what is my body doing to me. Right ? And so I think , first of all , being able to communicate with your partner about how it feels and what you're worried about , I also think I would love to see some education for men around how to support their partners going through menopause , everything from how hot flashes might feel to sleep changes , but also really , wouldn't it be a great gift to give women to reassure them that not only are they still sexy , but sex can and probably should change ? So if we look at the experience of women who have sex with other women , even pre-menopausal , those women experience orgasm and sexual satisfaction at much higher rates. And every five years or so , the New York Times will write an article like this is a big surprise to anyone , right ? Lesbians are having better , more orgasms than straight women are. Well , the reason is because sex isn't penis centered. And so sex can be defined in much broader ways. Sex can include receiving oral sex. Sex can include toys. Sex can include different kinds of lubrication. Sex can include more playing. But in general , when women have more time to feel safe and good in their bodies , when women can feel like they aren't rushed for penetration , when women can get wet either on their own or with lubrication. If women can orgasm before penetration , that ends up being sex , that is better for them. Whether we measure sex in terms of their rating of satisfaction or feeling connected or intimate. So moving the penis out of the center of the sex scene , I think is key.
S1: I'm curious to know. Oh , yeah , go ahead. Dr. Stone.
S3: I just wanted to add on to what you said , Jill , which I think is real important , is when I'm talking to groups of physicians , I always like to remind them of the importance of the couple and whomever that couple may be made up of. But there certainly is no shortage with attention to things like erectile dysfunction and pharmacological therapy to enhance that. So I say to. The physicians who have the opportunity to talk with me that please remember that you're dealing with a partnership and that you're the male. If that's the kind of couple this is , is going to get a pretty prompt result. But he might want to you know , they might want to be clued in that if they haven't been active in the bedroom for a while , that , you know , his female partner might have some other issues that can take a while even if she gets started on a vaginal therapy. So because when there's that mismatch , that can cause all sorts of added conflicts and hurt feelings and disappointment and on and on , that just really isn't necessary if this is approached as as the couple. So that's that's my $0.02 to remember the men in there too.
S4: I love that. Cynthia And I also think so interesting that a lot of men at the same time are having a reptile challenges right. And so I think often these conversations that maybe haven't occurred or haven't occurred in a while can really be helpful because often I think women sometimes take on the role of protecting the male ego around erections. And I think that if a man is starting to use Viagra or some sort of medication , that there can just be a lot of hurt feelings and a lot of possibility for missing each other. And so I think there can be this opportunity in this advanced place as we're aging to really come together again and maybe regroup around sex. And I think that can be fun and that can be good. Yeah.
S3: Yeah. Think the other thing Jill said was just to slow things down. And so , you know , the quickie in the hallway on the way to somewhere probably isn't as practical at some point. So that can help , too. Yeah.
S1: Yeah. You know , here's another question that ties into that. And this is from Heather.
S4: I think , for example , of faking orgasm is an illustration of women not talking to their partners about sex. Right. Um , and so I think there's lots of pejorative terms we associate with women who like sex too much or want to be pleased or like certain things. And so I think the shaming of women sexually combined with aging and I think feeling disoriented in our bodies as they start to change , I think can just be a lot of barriers and roadblocks to having a really vulnerable conversation.
S1: That was Jill Wood , a professor from Penn State University whose research on women's health includes menopause and the associated changes in sexual response and desire. She's part of the panel of experts we've brought together to answer your questions about menopause. After the break , we continue answering your questions about menopause and share your experiences. Dr..
S5: Dr.. Google helps a lot these days. You know , I would tell my primary care and there wasn't much of like , oh , you're going through perimenopause. They were just like , oh , yeah , it just is.
S1: You're listening to Kpbs Midday Edition. Welcome back. You're listening to Kpbs Midday Edition. I'm Jade Hindman. Our menopause conversation continues with Dr. Cynthia Dunkel and Penn State professor Jill Wood. They're answering your questions to provide information and education while encouraging you to consult with your health care provider for medical advice. We start with this audience question.
S3: My issue is vaginal atrophy. I had no idea that would happen , and it's distressing.
S6: In my relations with my husband. And it went from not being enjoyable to pretty much not being possible. That is a sad thing for a happy marriage.
S1:
S3: You know , and it takes a lot of courage to ask that question and just put that out there. And you can hear in her voice kind of some of the remorse and the the sad , the sadness of giving up that part of things. It is thought to be really never too late to consider starting vaginal estrogen therapy , which is going to be the most effective , especially if things have progressed as it sounds. It has. There are no limits. We tell women with systemic therapy in your whole body , you know , maybe 3 to 5 years considering some of the possible risk of breast cancer. There are no limits on duration for vaginal symptoms. I always tell women to beware of the package , insert , you know , the small print piece of paper that comes in with your prescription , because the Food and Drug Administration requires that manufacturers report all the same things that Dr. Lacroix mentioned. So you're reading in your new package of vaginal estrogen and it says heart attack , stroke , breast cancer and dementia. That could dampen your sex drive right there. But it's just not true. It's not been shown to be true. And so some of us have gone to the FDA and tried to get this revised and haven't had much luck. But I think the important thing is that if you're using vaginal vaginal estrogen therapy for a prolonged period of time , we don't currently recommend that women take a second hormone with it called a progesterone like you need to do if you're taking , again , larger dose systemic therapy. But certainly if women have any vaginal bleeding of note after they've been taking this for some time , then that's something you're going to want to let your doctor know about. So I think with these kind of symptoms , it would be important to go to your doctor and again , say be brave , be bold and say we haven't brought this up , but I'm really having this issue.
S1:
S5: My name is Shirley and I live in Alpine , California. I'm 51 , and as of last month was my year of having no period. So I'm excited for that. I didn't know about perimenopause. You know , I had to really Google. Dr.. Google helps a lot these days. You know , I would tell my primary care and there wasn't much of like , Oh , you're going through perimenopause. They were just like , Oh , yeah , it just is. But then my next surprise was , you know , having intercourse and it hurts. And I'm like , What is happening ? And then again , doing my reading and finding out that because of the lack of estrogen and it's just uncomfortable. And , you know , I've found a product online that you can moisturize yourself every three days and haven't gone to the doctor yet to even know if that's the best way to go. If there's supplements , I'd like to know more about what to do now with this part of the painful dry intercourse. And if using these internal vaginal moisturizers , if that's the way to go , if it's even safe , if it's , you know , not safe.
S1: Well , Jill , I want to get your response to that. And also , we heard the term vaginal atrophy.
S4: Sex should not hurt. And and I so I think that if sex is hurting , good for everyone to say this isn't right. Vaginal atrophy is really it's a medical term that Cynthia might be able to give more a more descriptive explanation. But vaginal atrophy is kind of this general term that describes the thinning of the vaginal walls and that the vagina starts to become drier and therefore less lubricated. I'll say that I think my problem with the term is that it defines the vagina in a pretty. Misogynistic , narrow way in terms of the value of vaginas for other people. Um , I have two more suggestions beyond Cynthia's vaginal estrogen , which I think does work for a lot of people. I think sometimes vaginal estrogen can get in the way of a woman experiencing oral sex cunnilingus because it can be messy and it could be a deterrent for a partner to go down on her. And so I think sometimes women. Might want that help , but might not want to let go of a practice that otherwise is sexually pleasurable and connecting for a couple. So my two suggestions are masturbation I. I talk about masturbation in terms of starting to understand how our body responds sexually and by sexual response. I'm talking about different models of how we move from a place of desire or sexual interest starting to feel aroused. And so one one marker of arousal is vaginal lubrication , but other ones are having your face feel flushed , nipples getting hard , kind of feeling alive and buzzy and maybe joyful or excited. And then whether or not someone moves into more excitement , maybe even with orgasm. So one of the ways I think that we best learn about how our bodies respond sexually is through masturbation. And so as we start to age and have vaginal changes , hot flashes , all sorts of differences in our skin , maybe feeling a little bit betrayed by our bodies , one of the things that really changes how women respond sexually is how we feel about our bodies. And so I think that spending time masturbating get a vibrator not not one that has to be inserted , get some really nice lube , lock your bedroom door , pour yourself a glass of wine or herbal tea and hang out with yourself. And I think that one of the things this eliminates is. The pressure on someone to have to walk through , figuring out what feels good or doesn't feel good and having to be careful of hurt feelings with a partner. Right ? So masturbation. Jocelyn Elders recommended masturbation decades ago as a way for us to get to know ourselves without any threats of pregnancy or STIs. So I'm following her advice. The second thing is there are some times where someone could benefit from seeing a vaginal physical therapist who often has a lot of training in how to help someone's pelvic floor muscles relax. Sometimes people have some psychological distress , maybe around previous trauma , maybe around resentment in the relationship. And so this might not just be a physical thing. I'm not saying that just for the people who ask , but who are listening is that way more so for women than for men. Context In terms of what we're thinking about our relationship with our body , our relationship with our partner is the house of Mass. Do we not go to the grocery store ? Right ? Like these things are also impacting our vagina. Our vagina is very smart and is listening to all of it. And so I think sometimes it's not just a hormone thing.
S1:
S3: And so the truth of it is , about close to a decade ago , a group of us got together and said , we really need to clean up this nomenclature because who wants to be told your body parts are especially particularly sensitive. Body parts are atrophying or shrinking up or drying up or going away. And so the term now that's used is kind of a mouthful. It's genital urinary. So ties in with the previous question we had about cystitis or urinary symptoms syndrome of menopause. So people just call it GSM and genital urinary syndrome and menopause covers all these things and at least gives the idea that there's more than just something going out that the designer and kind of elevates it a little bit in my view. I didn't mention that there are some other therapies. One is another vaginal therapy called Preston. That's a kind of a steroid hormone precursor that's changed into estrogen and testosterone in the vagina. Some women like that. And if people don't want to mess with their vaginas , there is a systemic therapy called feminine or aspirin that people can take as well. And some of the creams , for example , women might use them intently for like the first couple of weeks , but then after that they might do fine and their vaginas might do fine with just application once or twice a week. So that would kind of help with , I think some of the issues with I don't want my cream interfering with sex. I mean , you could just time things out that way. But the but the other point that she made that I think we don't talk enough about is that she said something that like sort of excited like no more periods , no more worries about contraception. That is such a heavy load for a lot of women and that can get in the way of their sex life if they're worried like , oh my God , I cannot get pregnant again and no more mood swings. Some women are quite debilitated by feelings of depression and anxiety that can cycle with their cycles , and all these things go away. So I do think we need to remember to kind of also look on the bright side of what happens. Margaret Mead , the great anthropologist who was a woman and in touch with her body , used to talk about post-menopausal zest and kind of like , I am finally free to , you know , do my thing , be me. I'm not as burdened by some of these other obligations childbearing , pregnancy , whatever. And I kind of like that. That appealed to me to , to look on the positive because , um , I don't want to be ashamed about my age. I don't want to be ashamed talking to my partner about what's happening with me. This is life. And so I think that if women sort of can embrace that part of this whole package that , you know , we can find a balance where we can look at all the good things for going forward , realizing that we might have one of my colleagues caused them speed bumps in the road of life that we have to get through during this menopause transition and beyond. But there are a lot of ways to accomplish that. So , um , looking on the bright side a little bit too.
S1: It really does sound like a lovely stage in life. All right. I want to ask about something Shirley mentioned. She says. She bought a vaginal moisturizer online. We don't know what specifically she bought , but there has been a proliferation of companies offering what they describe as menopause treatments.
S3: And like aisle number four at Costco are not regulated by the FDA. They do not have to be proven to be effective at anything. We don't have assurances about consistency of content or manufacturing process. So , I mean , most of the you know , as a as a surface , the vagina is going to be pretty resilient. So if you go to the drugstore or I guess read the contents , but some of these compounds would be unfamiliar to most of us what might be in these things. So , no , I can't really say that I know of a clearinghouse for I know lots of new things have sprung up for women's comfort in these times. And there have been investigations trying to sort out what some of these. Lubricants and moisturizers may control. So I usually just suggest that people try a few. Some they might like the consistency better , some might be uncomfortable or cause burning. Others might just feel better to them and see what appeals to them and works with their partner. Um , for the most part , I don't think they should be dangerous. But we live in a we live in a strange world and so don't know.
S4: I'm not sure what you think about that , but there is a big. There's a big new collection of scented dusting products and scented lubricants and everything from like white rain to , I don't know , daylilies. And I think that those tend to be irritating because there's lots of artificial stuff in them.
S1: Coming up , more of your menopause questions and answers.
S3: You really can stave off some of the negative aspects of weight change and metabolic change with menopause. So it's in your power to do that.
S1: You're listening to Kpbs Midday Edition. Welcome back. You're listening to Kpbs Midday Edition. I'm Jade Hindman. Our menopause conversation continues with Dr. Cynthia Dunkel and Penn State professor Jill Wood. They're answering your questions to provide information and education while encouraging you to consult with your health care provider for medical advice. I'm going to do a fire round right now with some of these questions.
S3: It's 20 years ago , and they found that if women at the time of starting to either in their mid-forties or starting to think that they might be starting to have the earliest of symptoms just started building exercise and wise food ingestion into their life program would not gain weight with menopause , would have less relocation of fat in their bodies and would come out metabolically much healthier. And we've learned things like from the Diabetes Prevention study that this can help. So think the very best thing and the most challenging thing , it's not easy , but is to really say , I'm turning a corner here. This is an opportunity for me to sort of do what I said , what I always say I'm going to do , but I don't quite get around to and really build those healthy lifestyle factors into your daily routine on your calendar with exercise and diet control and and you can beat it. You really can , you know , stave off some of the negative aspects of weight change and metabolic change with menopause. So it's in your power to do that.
S1: Sarah wants to know what kind of doctor do you recommend for the care of perimenopause ? She's right now going through acupuncture , paying out of pocket.
S3: And so that can be hard to find out sometimes. That's word of mouth , things like the North American Menopause Society. You can go on their website WW menopause.org and you put in your zip code and it will show you people in your area who have committed to being menopause experts. In fact , we have a standardized exam to be certified menopause experts that we ask for , groups like the Endocrine Society and the American College of ObGyn on their websites will post who is interested in menopause. If you live near a big medical center , think you can. You know , a lot of health care plans have , you know , find a doctor things to help out. And so you can go and ask them who is interested in menopause. And there are people who are out there who some of them might be OB GYNs who say , I'm tired of delivering babies , I'm moving along with my patients into menopause. And so I'm going to focus on that. Now , some might be family physicians , some might be endocrinologist , some might be nurse practitioners or physician assistants who really have developed an expertise. So there's a wide menu of clinicians , and sometimes you just have to dig a little bit to find them.
S1: All right. What about hair loss ? Laura says it's been an unexpected and painful part of menopause for her.
S3: And so it depends on the kind of hair loss she's having. We often recommend that patients will see a dermatologist to make sure that they don't have a specific inflammation or something specific going on that could be corrected with hair loss. Some of it might be just an age related thing. And it's not just the loss of hormones , because if you read the package labeling carefully , taking hormones can sometimes be associated with hair loss as well. So I don't know of any magic solutions to this. Sometimes women will use one of the male preparations , but it's dosed for women to just smooth on their scalp to find a way to possibly enhance hair growth. But I would start by if you're really having a tough time with that , talking to a dermatologist.
S1: Jill , what are your thoughts on that ? I feel like every five minutes there's a commercial on television for hair replacement therapy. What are your thoughts on that for for women who are going through menopause ? Right.
S4: I'll also say maybe not necessarily hair loss , but also changes in hair , hair getting coarser , hair just like laying differently. Um , and so to know that if someone isn't having hair loss but is having changes in coarseness or just dryness , to know that that is also a normal experience. And so this idea of vaginal dryness. Also extends to our skin , our eyes. I when I started going through menopause , I had to put a lot more drops in to have my contacts not blur. And so this kind of dryness is a holistic change overall.
S3: I would just say as an endocrinologist , that we know that women develop more thyroid disturbances kind of in this midlife phase. So too much or too little thyroid hormone can affect our hair. We can develop issues where we have our body makes too much of the cortisol hormone that's in steroids that can effect hair loss. So think there are some medical things that could be checked out. Too much testosterone in a woman , too much of the male hormone can affect hair loss. So there are some things that we can look for medically if it's a real issue. But for the most part , it's think it's kind of one of those frustrating things. It's often hard to put our finger on anything specific.
S1: Wow , this has been such a valuable insight from you all.
S4: I have found that social support and even a little bit of humor and you know , someone saying , Yeah , me too , helps me feel just a little more grounded and better. And also yoga , yoga , yoga , yoga.
S3: I think being cautious , though. And sometimes women get so scared off by an individual who's having a really off scale tough time in it. And so , you know , most people fall kind of into the middle. So I would caution women just because a friend or family member had a really tough , tough time , does it mean that you're going to and so think learning about some positive resources would be a good thing. Again , I can't emphasize enough using quality evidence based information on the Internet from groups like the North American Menopause Society , the American College of ObGyn , just who have experts who have taken care of lots of women and stick with the the science , because there certainly is a science to this. But again , like Margaret Mead , focus on , you know , getting through this passage , most women will live 40% of their lives after menopause. So , ladies , it cannot all be downhill. Right. And so in addition to some of the people that Andrea mentioned , I look at Jane Fonda , Lily Tomlin , you know , the group of women in their 70s and 80s who are just having such a good time. I don't think menopause , you know , stop them from moving forward. So , you know , it's a bump in the road , but look in a positive way to the other side.
S1: All right. I'd like to thank our panel for a conversation that was much needed. We hope a lot of women feel seen , feel heard and know that they're not going through this alone. All right. So something else that's gaining traction across the world is menopause. Leave Catherine Blossom Schwarber is a women's health advocate who's behind the push here in the US. Her involvement was inspired by the tough decision she made to step away from her career as a business executive once her perimenopause symptoms became too much to manage. I spoke with her in March about what menopause leave might look like here.
S7: The thing that I love about the idea of menopause leave is that I feel it is a kind of lightning rod conversation around providing more menopause support for women in the workplace. Right. So one of the big elements in this conversation is when you think about your prime earning years as a woman or , you know , the average age of a female CEO is 51 and the average age of a woman entering menopause is 51. It is a time in your life where you are expected to be at the absolute pinnacle of everything that you have been from our career standpoint. And being able to find flexibility in that work is really , really important. So menopause leave can be the ability to take flexible work hours to be able to work from home or to actually be able to take days or time off. When you are feeling under duress with your body that you can't perform up to the level that you would normally perform. And to be able to make those kinds of requests without shame or without changing your relationship with the people that you work with , that's really what menopause leave is. But I think that part of this is even being able to get allowances to say , I'm going to sit in this meeting while I'm having a hot flash if I feel like it right. And then not everybody is looking at you saying , oh , my God , why is she sitting in this meeting having a hot flash ? Right. It's just another natural thing that. Happens for women or having a quiet space that you can go to. Similar to a mothering room where if you're feeling , you know , some women get terrible headaches , some women have extreme fatigue. Right. A place where you could go and take a little time out of your day to recenter and regain your composure so that you can perform at the level you want , I think is all part of the opportunity around menopause leave. But ultimately it's being able to take time out of your normal work schedule without being penalized and say , I need to take a menopause time out.
S1:
S7: Right. A lot of women washed out during Covid , after Covid. You know , even when we think about quiet quitting , I feel like it's often referred to for younger employees. But I think that it's a big impact also for older employees who feel that they're being pushed around or that they're locked in jobs that they don't really want to be in , but they don't see another path forward. And I think that being able to offer leave and support and care is a major opportunity for employers , especially for retention and engagement , because even if you don't necessarily take advantage of the opportunity , knowing that your employer put that in place as something that you can leverage is really important. The other part that I would add to that is I think that it's incumbent on all of us to think about employer benefits related to menopause as a kind of a two part process , because one of the things for me is that and many women is that you don't necessarily know that you're in perimenopause , right ? You just begin to feel that these crazy things are happening to your body. So I wouldn't have even known to look for those benefits as something that I could take advantage of. So we have to be educating women on the individual level , right ? On the consumer level , which is a lot of what we are doing , while also educating employers about offering those benefits to women when they're ready to take advantage of them. Very similar to fertility benefits , right ? Until you know that you're going to need fertility support , you aren't necessarily seeking that benefit. But when you do need it and it's there , you really appreciate the level of effort your employer went to to make that available to you.
S1:
S7: You see more and more organizations offering the components of making sure that you can get access to hormonal medication. Doctors who are experts. I think that's probably the first step that we will see. And beyond that , I think at the at the edge , part of what we do see is more flexible leave in general for mental health days , right ? For days when you're just generally feeling like you need to reboot. And I believe that our our path forward is really. Thinking about collaborating with those kinds of benefits to be able to expand them to menopause benefits as well.
S1: That was Catherine Schwarber , CEO of Kendra , a self care company for women in menopause. And a few more of you listeners shared your experiences with us. Let's take a listen. This is Emily from San Diego.
S8: The beginning of perimenopause was so abrupt and so immediate that it affected my whole life. I was insomnia , 1 to 2 hours of night of sleep , if that , not the classic hot flashes. So then I never thought what I was experiencing was a hormone shift. So then I suffered for a whole year not sleeping 1 to 2 hours a night and then trying to go to work. Until one day it dawned on me , Oh my God. So I went to UCSD and I went to an allergist and then started my path for treatment that way. But I feel sorry for myself and any other woman. Who is not told what to look for or that. You could have other symptoms other than the classic hot flash , and that could be perimenopause.
S9: When I was 39.5. All of a sudden I thought I was going crazy. Nobody had talked about it. And suddenly I couldn't remember things. I was in a brain fog. I just didn't understand what was wrong with me. And then I heard somebody talk about it on the radio. A couple of months later. And so on my 40th birthday , I went into my doctor and I got tested and she said , Yes , your estrogen is dropping. And I think you've started menopause early. Ever since then , it's just been dealing with it.
S1: And that was Heidi from El Cajon. Thank you for joining us. Tomorrow at noon on Midday Edition , we're talking to the mayors of El Cajon and Chula Vista about homelessness in their cities. And of course , if you ever miss a show , you can find the Midday Edition podcast wherever you listen. I'm Jade Hindman. Thanks for tuning in.
