MICHEL MARTIN, host:
I'm Michel Martin. This is TELL ME MORE from NPR News.
Black comic strip artists and some of their white colleagues take a stand for diversity on the comics pages. We'll find out why and how they think it went. But first, we want to talk more about the state of the presidential race with NPR's political editor, Ken Rudin. He's also known as our Political Junkie. He's here with me in the studio.
Hi, Ken.
KEN RUDIN: Hi, Michel.
MARTIN: The Obama sweep this weekend of the nominating contests in Maine, Louisiana, Washington, Nebraska and the Virgin Islands - anything surprising in there? I thought going in - there was some thought that it would be closer, that it would be closer, that there would be more of a split?
RUDIN: Well, even if it wasn't a surprise, the fact that it was - everything was landslide. Obama won like 57, 58 percent Louisiana. He crushed Hillary Clinton in states like Nebraska, Washington state, so it's not so much that he won all (unintelligible) an eye-opening, but the fact that he won by such huge margins, I think that just said a lot of about the campaign.
MARTIN: In the - well, what did it say about the campaign?
RUDIN: Well, I think…
MARTIN: I mean, what do you account for the victory - better organized, better advertising, better message?
RUDIN: Well, one thing, he's to be on a roll. And it's interesting to say that he's on a roll given the fact that if you look at the popular votes, if you look at the delegates, they're pretty much even. So, it's not that he's winning and she's losing, but first of all, he is very well organized. If you look at caucus states, starting in Iowa, the Obama campaign has really gotten a lot of committed people to come out, spend a lot of hours, you know, trying to argue, cajole other fellow Democrats to get them to vote for Obama. And it's worked. It's really worked. And since he's in the state and he's winning in Idaho, Nebraska, Kansas - these are not blue states, shall we say. It's not that kind of states that Democrats will pick up in November, but it's a kind of state that sends a message to other Democrats, perhaps, that if a Democrat is going to have a chance in the country in 2008, it could be Barack Obama who's winning where Democrats don't win.
MARTIN: In the wake of this weekend sweep, Senator Clinton replaced her campaign manager. Is there a history of campaigns recovering from these kinds of shakeups at this point in the process? I mean, normally, we would think this is very early. But in this calendar, it's not early.
RUDIN: Well, actually, it is very early, and it's late. More than half the states have already voted, so that shows that it pretty perhaps is pretty late. But again, it's not that's over for Hillary Clinton's campaign. He's still has a lot of hope resting on Ohio and Texas on May - on March 4th, where a lot of delegates are at stake. So this far from over.
But, you know, we've seen the past that what you do. You don't fire - you know, if your pitcher is struggling or your homerun hitter is not hitting the ball, you don't fire your players, you fire your manager. And, obviously, somebody has to tell Hillary Clinton that something is not working. Obviously, the voters are not showing any kind of rapport with her, at least in many, many states. Barack Obama said over the weekend that - look, 47 percent of the country would never vote for Hillary Clinton. Well, that's true or not, it sends a signal that if Hillary Clinton is to be the Democratic nominee, Democrats have to realize that she's got to win in November, and she obviously has to change her message, perhaps Maggie Williams will bring that.
MARTIN: Let's get past the Potomac primary tomorrow, because we talk about that with D.C. Delegate Eleanor Holmes-Norton. Going ahead to Ohio and Texas, talk to us about what - how the campaign looks there. You got kind of a traditional sort of Rust Belt state, Ohio, a traditional swing state. And the presidential election in Texas, which is the last place where Hispanic voters really have a say.
RUDIN: Right. And, of course, the message on Rush Limbaugh's Web site today that Hillary Clinton fired her top Latina in the campaign was not a good signal to Latino voters around the country, too. But look, before we do that, we knew from the beginning that this would be a very good month for Barack Obama, in addition to what's at stake - on Tuesday - we have Hawaii, which is a caucus, where he's born - could do very well. A lot of white liberals in Wisconsin could do, you know, put Obama over the top. But Ohio, it's Rush Belt. It's union workers. It's blue-collar workers. That's where Hillary Clinton have done very well. And Texas, with all the Latino voters, she's done very well with Latino voters. Hispanics went for her two to one in California. She's banking on that. But if a Barack Obama wins every state from now until March 4th, that could send a signal that why wait for March 4th for Hillary Clinton to come back? It could be the sign of a Obama bandwagon.
MARTIN: Let's talk about the Republicans. Mike Huckabee won Kansas and Louisiana over the weekend. But does it matter? Is he mathematically able to win enough delegates at this point with the nomination?
RUDIN: Theoretically, yes. What really matters is that if John McCain has already been anointed the all-but-certain nominee, the fact that he's still not winning over conservatives - we saw him booed last week at the Conservative Political Action Conference in Washington. We saw that Mike Huckabee won Louisiana, won Kansas. He actually basically had a draw in Washington state, and if there's still…
MARTIN: Where he's contesting the results.
RUDIN: Exactly. There's still hesitancy among many conservatives. That's not the kind of momentum John McCain wants to get if he wants to go into the general election against Barack Obama or Hillary Clinton.
MARTIN: What do you think - and I'm asking you to speculate, here - President Bush still won't give him the big abraco? I mean, he talked about it over the weekend in an interview with Fox News, and he earlier endorsed his issues as Mitt Romney did, talking about the sort of the fight against terrorism, how important that is and national security being considered to be John McCain's strong suit - say that he considers McCain a conservative but also said, you know, he's got some work to do. Why do you think he doesn't kind of embrace him more firmly?
RUDIN: Well, I think there's residual anger or distrust between the two, which has gone back to 2000 when the campaigned against each other. Of course, John McCain has not been a loyal foot soldier in the Bush revolution - voted against the two tax cuts, disagrees with the Bush administration on torture and things like that. But also, I think, in fairness to President Bush, the race is not over. Mike Huckabee has not dropped out of the race, neither has Ron Paul. And I think until the race is over, until the candidates are out of it, President Bush will have a hands-off attitude.
MARTIN: Ken Rudin, Political Junkie, NPR's political editor, here with me in the studio in Washington.
Thank you.
RUDIN: Thanks, Michel.
MARTIN: Come back and see us some time. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
