S1: Hey there , San Diego , it's time for KPBS roundtable. I'm Andrew Bracken. On today's show , we get the latest involving questions over local congressional candidates military status. We talk with KPBS military reporter all about his coverage and how he focuses it. Then we turn to the written word for our San Diego Storyteller series. We hear from San Diego's inaugural poet laureate about his work and the lasting power of poetry. And the San Diego book crawls back. This weekend , we hear more about the larger landscape of independent bookstores in the San Diego region. That's ahead on KPBS roundtable. It's been quite a week in the world of the military , amid the ongoing tensions in the Strait of Hormuz and the war in Iran. But also advocates are reacting to a reported plan to send Afghan Afghan allies and their families to the Congo , not the United States. And one local congressional candidate was found to be violating Pentagon rules. Today , we are checking in on the latest military news with KPBS military and Veterans Affairs reporter Andrew Dyer. Hey , Andrew. Welcome back.
S2: Hey , thanks for having me again.
S3: Yeah , it seems like it was only yesterday.
S1: So , um , this week , you know , you've covered such a range of topics here around the military , but let's start with the most recent. It's an update of an earlier story you did. Amar Campana Jha is running for Congress and made his status as a Navy Reserve officer kind of part of his campaign. Tell us more about the reporting and the latest with that story.
S2: So yeah , it started um , last month , whenever , uh , actually , La Prensa wrote a story , um , kind of detailing the the Pentagon's rules and how they relate to campaigning. Reservists are allowed to run for office. That's not a problem , but there's strict guidelines on how you present yourself in your campaign because , you know , uniformed military personnel don't normally engage in partisan politics. But you can , you know , have your picture and some biographical information , but they don't want you to kind of make your uniform photo the primary photo on your campaign materials. And if you are in the Navy Reserve , then they want you to clearly state that you are an officer in the Navy Reserve. Any time you mention your your status or your your position in the military. So that's where a lot of his materials on his campaign website , uh , you know , initially had just said naval officer , um , and you had to kind of scroll all the way to the bottom before you found where it said that it was , uh , it was in the reserves.
S1: So , I mean , a lot of this is around this distinction between being an officer in the Navy versus being one in the Navy reserves. Can you talk more about that distinction and why ? You know , many in the military community think it's really an important distinction. Sure.
S2: Sure. And it's not a knock on on the reserves at all , you know ? Um , you know , it is it is service. You are in the military. It's not , um , it's not a knock on on any of that. But , you know , the the level of commitment required is kind of the most obvious example. Um , so I talked to a couple of veterans last month , uh , guy Brian Van Riper. Uh , he was in the Marines.
S4: There is a huge worldly difference between , you know , doing a week , a month , and then a couple weeks a year versus full time.
S2: And we also talked to Mark ball , who was a Navy surface officer who was on active duty for a number of years , but then also served in the reserves.
S5: There's a reason why I say I did almost ten years and the last two was as a reservist , because I want to make it very clear that , like there is that line of distinction between the active duty and the reserve side.
S2: And so this is where folks were upset with Amar's campaign or campaign campaign because they thought that it appeared he was presenting himself as , as a naval officer on active duty. You know , deploying even though his website did not say he had deployed. But the impression that people got was that he was in , you know , inflating his his military resume. On the on the website , you know , he speaking with him , you know , and he denies that. He says he's trying to , you know , follow the rules and get things right. But , um , what happened this week was an email from the inspector general of the Navy Reserves , was sent to a guy who had filed a complaint about the website last month , and the the inspector general said basically that they found some some issues they forwarded to the chain of command. The chain of command issued corrective action. They didn't say what that action was , but , um. But they found some other issues on social media. On the on his Facebook page and had sent that also to his chain of command. Um , I talked to I.
S1: Want to talk more about. Yeah , talking to him. But first , I mean , we're kind of also talking about these symbols here , right ? And I think you've talked about just the importance of a uniform. I think for a lot of folks that may not have served in the military , we may or may not understand , you know , the important elements that go into a uniform. But tell us more about why that's important , because that kind of played in a role in this , right ? Is like the way the uniform was laid out and certain details. Right.
S2: Right. Because the photos that he's using , um , are from when he first was commissioned as a , as an incident. That was in 2023. So , you know , when you when you first joined you haven't really done anything yet. So you don't have any of the ribbons. You know , a uniform is like a it's like a resume. You're a walking resume. People can see your qualifications. They can see if you've deployed. They can see in some cases where you deployed just by looking at your uniform. So , um , that jumped out to folks that his uniform was blank. Um , you know , I asked the Navy Reserve about it , and , you know , he's since been promoted to lieutenant , junior grade. But , you know , all of his photos are still with his his old rank , which , you know , I mean , I was in the Navy. And when I got promoted , the first thing I did was so a new a new CRO on my , my uniform. Right.
S1: So it was a big deal. Yeah.
S2: Yeah. You know , you're exactly right. You you want to you you earned it. You you wear it. So I think just culturally there are some things that , you know , while not like against any rule or anything , they just felt off to a lot to a lot of folks.
S1: You mentioned you've got a chance to speak with a mark.
S2: They , um , after it was after we had published our story last month that , um , his general command issued their corrective action , which , according to , to him , was just , um , they emailed him the , the regulation and told him to make sure his stuff was compliant. So he went back and , you know , they they changed the stuff on the website. They updated some some things. They added the language that was needed. And um , a day or two later , they got back to him and said the website was all good.
S1: So you've been reporting on the story , obviously. I mean , he's a candidate in a very competitive congressional race right now. Uh , the primary election is coming up fast. Um , this is the 48th district was a very red district. But now , you know , someone someone new is going to replace Darrell Issa there.
S2: I mean , everything's political , right ? But , you know , I approach this as a military and veterans story. Uh , first and foremost , um , he happens to be running for office , but there's a lot of interesting aspects about his candidacy that , you know , maybe don't apply to other candidates even in his race. And this is one of the the gripes his campaign has with this story and this reporting is that , you know , Jim Desmond , his Republican opponent , is a military veteran. Um , Kevin , Georgia's previous , uh , opponent for Chula Vista mayor , John McCann , is also a Navy reservist. Both of these people have information and photos and their materials. And , you know , we're not giving these individuals the same level of scrutiny. Maybe as more Kevin gets. And , you know , that's a valid point. I heard criticism of that from , you know , our audience after after the first story. You know , there are a lot of folks support our campaign. But , you know , the fact is and you can't You can't avoid this. Fact is that most politicians , um , most people who are veterans , who go into politics , they go into politics after they've had a military career , and folks like John McCain , even though he is still in the reserve , and Jim Desmond , these are public figures they've been elected officials for for years. And , you know , when you and I speak about Jim Desmond or John McCann , you know , we're not talking about military members. We're not talking about anything other than elected officials. But with America , it's it's a lot different. You know , I mean , he's run for office three times , twice for Congress , once for mayor of Chula Vista. And each of these campaigns was just racked with , you know , I don't know , missteps , uh , controversies. Um , some he's had issues in each campaign. Right. Um , and , um , among those issues are accusations of , you know , inflating resumes. Um , there was an issue when he was running for Chula Vista mayor , where his opponent , John McCann , you know , hired like a private investigator , followed him around and found him , you know , spending a lot of time at his girlfriend , Congresswoman Sarah Jacobs house and not the house in Chula Vista , where he had.
S1: Questions of residency and things. Yeah. Right.
S2: Right. So there's a lot of baggage here that that maybe isn't true with the other candidates. So whenever after he lost his the race for mayor , you know , he turns up getting a direct commission into the Navy Reserve and then almost immediately starts running for office again. So there's a there's an aspect to his service. And when he talks about his service , you know , I have no reason to doubt him. You know , he talks about serving for the reasons that a lot of people sort of talk about. Right. And they love the country. They want to serve. They want to , you know , he says all of the right things , you know. But I think the timing and the circumstances , you know , put together , you know , create this context where , you know , it does warrant scrutiny , the way he uses his service. And he's made that service such a big part of his campaign in his new identity that , you know , it raises a lot of questions.
S1: So I want to pivot to another story you covered this week. The Trump administration announced plans potentially to have move wartime Afghan allies and their families that are now in Qatar camp right to the Democratic Republic of Congo , potentially bring us up to speed there.
S2: So this has been going on since Trump took office. You know , after the fall of Kabul , a lot of community members , veterans , advocacy groups , people in government , the State Department , uh , refugee resettlement organizations , they all worked very hard together to come up with a system to process Afghans , to let them resettle in the United States. They knew that there was going to be a lot of Republican opposition to this resettlement. And so they kind of designed this system of , you know , vetting and security. You know , you know , the fingerprints. They do the background checks. Um , but the thing is , is that a lot of these Afghans are known to the US government. They're known to the US military because they worked with the military for we were in Afghanistan for 20 years. I mean , 20 years of of people coming in as contractors , as truck drivers , as whatever they're doing with the military. That is a long history. And there's a lot of paper. If you ever talk to somebody in the military , there's a lot of paperwork involved with everything you do in the military. So we know who these people are. But , um , regardless , they have the strict vetting. They're they're processing them through. And one of the ways that they would do this was , you know , as you're going through the the asylum process , whether that's a visa or the parole program. They would the State Department would fly you from Afghanistan or Pakistan into these kind of third country waypoints , almost. And one of them was this base in Doha , Qatar. And that's where they would stay there for weeks , a couple months , and then be brought to the United States as soon as Trump's inaugurated. He says he halts all refugee resettlement , all travel. So people that were in that process , um , all of a sudden were just dropped. And they've just been sitting at this camp.
S1: Like vetted and.
S2: Yeah , many of them vetted and approved to travel. Some of them were in different , different steps in the process. But all of them , none of nobody was brought to Doha who wasn't already in the pipeline to to resettle here. So , um , yeah , they've just been there and there's been no plan. No , no , nothing from the administration about what they're going to do with these Afghans that we as a country took from , took brought them there and stuck them there and said , we're going to we're going to resettle you and then the administration change and actually just sit tight. We'll let you know. And then nothing.
S1: So this goes , yeah.
S2: You know , they tell them that , you know , if you work with us , you know , we're going to you'll be safe. You'll you'll have the option to to immigrate. You know , the service kind of gives you a , gives you that , that in um , but what we found out this week was that , um , they've , they this year the Trump administration said they're closing the camp in Doha , but they announced that they're closing the camp before they had even found anything to do with the the folks that are there. So they said , we're going to close the camp , but they didn't say what they were going to do with all the Afghans. And then this week , we found out that they're working on a deal to send them to the Democratic Republic of Congo , which is in armed conflict , which is under its own refugee crisis. And it was just , um , you know , it really kind of , uh , struck the entire community , the the folks in the camp , uh , they wrote a letter , they had their own statement out. You know , they don't want to go to Congo. They don't speak the language. It's not it's not there. But their their alternative is to go back to Afghanistan , which , you know , maybe that's what the administration wants to do all along , is just send them back to Afghanistan , um , where they face , um , reprisal from from the Taliban , including , you know , death.
S1: You know , we have about a minute left here. I mean , this is just we're just touching on the range of stories that you've covered just this week , right ? You did a story on the Strait of Hormuz , naval warships involvement there. You know what we're seeing with the refugees you're just talking about. But there's also so much else happening. Right. I mean , the Navy has a Navy lost their leader this week. I mean , there's just a lot. I'm wondering if you can share with us in the time we have left.
S2: The ones that impact the local community the most. Um , I kind of just and also just my own judgment. Like , what am I interested in as a , as a person who follows this stuff ? I hope that what's interesting to me is interesting to the audience as well. That's I kind of just follow my gut like that. Right. There's , um , you know , the New York Times , The Washington Post , every outlet is , is going to have a story on the Secretary of the Navy. You don't need KPBS to tell you what's going on there. But some of the other , uh , more locally connected stories is , is where we fit in well.
S1: We appreciate all your reporting and sharing it with , you know , with us today , and we'll catch up on these and other stories. You can find all of Andrew's reporting on KPBS website , KPBS. And again , Andrew Dyer has been joining me. He's KPBS military and veterans affairs reporter. Andrew , thanks again. Hey.
S2: Hey. Thank you.
S1: Coming up , a San Diego storytellers conversation with poet Ron Salisbury. KPBS roundtable is back after the break. Welcome back to KPBS roundtable. I'm Andrew Bracken. Roundtable has always been a place for journalists to come. Share more about the stories they're telling here in our region. But the San Diego Tijuana region is home to a lot of other kinds of storytellers as well. And we want to highlight some of them with our series San Diego Storytellers. Poetry is one of the purest art forms. The life of a poet often , though , is not met with riches or exuberant accolades. Yet a beautiful poem has a way to connect to an emotional truth we can't find elsewhere. Ron Salisbury is a poet. He was San Diego was first ever poet laureate , and he's the author of the poetry collections. Please write and tell me what I Looked Like When You Met Me and Miss Desert Inn. He also teaches poetry at the Writers Inc. here in San Diego. Ron Salisbury , welcome.
S6: Well , thank you , Andrew. Thank you for inviting me today , especially at this month , which is National Poetry Month.
S1: It is. Yes it is. Thanks for making the time for us. So tell us how you found your love of poetry. Because it happened pretty early in your life. Yeah.
S6: Yeah. It was about ten years old. I was in seventh grade in Maine , and it was a small school where the teacher taught all of the subjects and for the English subject for the end of the school week , he gave us copies , mimeographed copies of poems. And my particular one was from Robert Frost. And we had to go home and write a poem and bring it in on Monday , and something magic happened. I saw A kind of a keyhole to the soul that weekend , from which surprised me , from being from Maine , At 10 or 11 years old. And that's all I've ever wanted to be since then.
S1: Well , I want to hear more about your journey because , you know , Bangor , Maine is about the opposite of San Diego and how that journey happened.
S6: There wasn't as many opportunities to be able to study poetry in the late 40s. In the early 50s , especially in rural Maine , I got out of there and went to the New York City and Las Vegas and San Francisco and and San Diego , all in a journey that's with it and always kept poetry there. I taught , I read , and I studied and took many , many workshops as they become to be available throughout the United States during that time. And then I kind of as an ultimate I became an Aztec for life right here in San Diego I went in 2013 , went to the San Diego to the Master of Fine Arts program and Poetry at West Issue. Yeah.
S1: Yeah. And I imagine I mean , you were quite older than the other students , right ? And this is kind of an important aspect of your work , at least right now. Yes. Um , you know , talk more about the process of , of of aging you describe. I don't know. You've described your work as poetry of the aging person. Yes.
S6: Yes. Um , you know , it's a it's a culture based on youth. And so there's expectations of how people who are aged in aging should act or should think or should be. And that's not really accurate. And yet this is kind of a hidden population , the old ones. And because it is youth oriented. And I like to make fun of that. I like to poke fingers at the expectations of how I'm supposed to feel and act. And if I can find something that is surprising or different from what people expect. That's kind of the root of what I want to talk about.
S1: Okay , we got to get to it. The heart of it can't have you here without , you know. I'm wondering if you can read a poem for us. Sure.
S6: Sure. I'll tell you a little bit. First off , we have secondary meanings to words. Let's take the seasons. Spring is youth. Spring is birth. Summer is. Is maturity. Fall is aging. It's the reaping of the harvest. It's the beginning to fade. And winter is always a symbol for death. So this poem I'm reading is called August because it matches the time of it. So obviously it's in the aging part. And in this poem the speaker is male and death knocks on the door. There's also one other thing that is in this poem is the name Eunice. Um , Oftentimes the poet , in order to free himself from writing about himself , or will write in the voice of other people a persona. And I have two. I have a male named Reggie that I write poems in his voice and about him. And Eunice is the female equivalent of it. So the speaker here is male , and Eunice is also in the poem. It's called August. I thought I'd have more time in the August of us. The more still sets in the one mode trough out back. The recipe for midges corn salsa taped to the microwave. The dog needs flea dip. I thought I'd have more time when he knocked at two in the afternoon. There were two books with markers halfway through Eunice , I call. Can you come here ? I haven't told you all. Six months of New Yorkers piled beside the chair. But everyone has those. Eunice. You know all I haven't said , don't you ? I didn't think he'd look like this. And I almost didn't let him in. Eunice. It's all the empty space you fill. You know , I'm taking the last picture of us. The one with you and the yellow hat and me squinting.
S1: Thank you. That was August by Ron Salisbury. I mean , can you tell us a little bit about your approach to it ? You mentioned these different personas or these different characters you approach , but , you know , what do you remember about writing this particular poem ? Hmm.
S2:
S6: Well , I write an awful lot. I'm quite prolific , and so to ask me for the individual inspiration for one poem is like finding that needle in a haystack. But my general process is because I teach a lot of writing of poetry , is that most people that come there think that writing poetry , as you sit down and write it for an hour a day or whatever it is. But most poets that I know. Not all , but most poets I know spend more time reading poetry than they do writing it. And so our inspiration becomes triggered from our environment. And if the environment is other people's poetry , that's what happened. You walk outside your house every day. If you have your poetry goggles on , you'll see poems. You just have to be ready for them. It's out there. So this is about aging. It's about death. And that is a constant theme with most poets that are old.
S1: You also say a poem changes when it's shared.
S6: One is private and one is public , and the private poetry is what we. All right. And we keep it to ourselves. We put it in a box. We don't share it with anyone else. And those are wonderful poems that are significant to our own birth and our own cycle of life and everything else. The issue becomes a problem when we take that private poem and say , okay , I want others to know what I know. I want to now share it. Now we get into the craft of poetry. You have another partner in it , and you have to. You have to recognize that you're going to use a little bit of control with it. And when you read a poem to someone , remember they don't have it on the page in front of them. So you've got to be clear of what you're saying. Because good poems often are complex , and they require looking at. And if all you're going to do is hear it the first time , that's you have to be careful of what it is you're reading to someone else. If they're not going to have a copy in front of them. So you choose ones that are accessible. That's it. They may not be your best point , but they may be the best accessible poems.
S1: Do you prefer. I mean , you mentioned the importance of reading poetry in your work. That kind of plays into it. But I mean , you prefer the written word for for experiencing poetry rather than hearing it say , you know.
S6: Well , 90/90 percent of the portrait is consumed in the United States. It's consumed on a page or on a screen out loud. Poetry is 10% at most of what is going on. So most of the poetry that is happening day in and day out is on a page or on a screen. It's when you hear it that is a problem because you have one chance to get it. And so there's a simplification that happens with that. That may not happen in good , complex poems that are on pages. And if 90% of the the work that's produced and read in the United States.
S1: And also the nature of how we experience poetry goes through changes.
S6: Well , for one thing , it's allowed , um , massive amounts of poetry to be available. That doesn't mean massive amounts of good poetry , but just means massive amounts of poetry journals. It used to get 1500 mailed entries for being publishing and now getting 20,000 in a year. And so the handling of it is very difficult to do with it. And that has opened up the possibilities for anyone to write , not just the exclusivity that it used to be. It's with it. So it's.
S1: It's opened it. Up.
S6: Up. Yeah. It's great that it's happened , but it comes with problems. It's hard to sort through and find the good ones.
S1: Is it hard to teach poetry ? I mean , can you teach someone to write a poem.
S6: Like you can't teach someone poetry ? You can teach somebody that has the poetry gene to be a better poet. But you can teach people to whatever they're writing to do it better. You know , there's a big difference between writing poetry and being a poet. Same way as. You could play a flute , but how long is it ? And what do you have to do to be a musician ? But somehow we think that if we write a poem , we're a poet. If we if we think of it differently. Yes , anybody can write a poem and it's wonderful. But to be a poet , you have to study , you have to work , and you work at it hard for a long time before it begins to gel with that.
S1: We talked about how aging has been playing a part in your work. I'm curious , how about San Diego ? I mean , you you started your journey in Maine. Yeah , came to San Diego , but you also had a unique , somewhat unique experience here that you sort of two different eras in San Diego. Yes.
S6: Yes. I have gone in the late 70s when I first came to San Diego , and I was teaching at that time workshops and poetry at D.G. Wills , a bookstore and coffee shop in La Jolla. My wife at the time was going to graduate school , and then life progressed and for until 2008 when I came back. That's here. And this has always felt homelike to me. And it's a vibrant poetry place right now. There's lots of it going on. It got stymied a bit with the as everything did with Covid , but it's coming back and it's it's vibrant. It's out there. It's an active world right now.
S1: I wonder if you can leave us with with one more poem. Sure.
S6: Sure. Uh , this is another one that , um , has something in it in here. Eunice again appears. And it's also a poet writing about writing. Writing about having a profession as a poet or as a creative writer at all. And how is that viewed ? Beside that , I also have an old relative of mine long dead named Uncle Linwood , who once got hit by lightning. So , so many things can ruin a picnic. There is both fear and fascination with how lightning may strike. The only thing tall in a field of fescue. Take my Uncle Linwood , for instance , who often walked into his ten acre holding with one overgrown crabapple tree to see if the hand of God would stretch out and slap that unproven spire. Until one time God passed over the obvious and took aim at Linwood. We were all fascinated with chance and the seduction of fatal danger. Take marriage , for instance , lest the hand of God , than the spite of Eunice , who finally clearly sees your lack of ambition as a lack of ambition and not an artistic streak.
S1: And the title of that poem again.
S6: So many things can ruin a picnic.
S1: Well , I mean , you mentioned , you know , a little bit of your journey. Um , we have about two minutes left here. Um , you know , finding your way was not a straight line to becoming a poet. Um , I mean , how do you reflect on that journey and.
S6: Well , it's from my own personal cases. A guy never had a plan. There was never anything I wanted to be. Because at 11 , I wanted to be a poet. But you can't make a living in a poet. And I didn't go to college until late in life. But. So you did many things. And I worked my way through careers all the way across the United States , from Las Vegas to being a banker to being an international banker , to running my own chain of espresso bars and all through that. The reason I did that was so I could write poetry.
S1: I've been speaking with poet Ron Salisbury. He was San Diego's first ever poet laureate , and you can actually sign up for Ron's Poem a week project on his website on Salisbury Comm. We'll have a link to that on our website and our show notes. Ron , thank you so much for being here.
S6: Thank you Andrew.
S1: Up next , we'll continue our theme on the written word. Take a closer look at the San Diego book crawl happening this weekend. You're listening to KPBS roundtable. Welcome back to KPBS roundtable. I'm Andrew Bracken. Like , we just heard the experience of picking up a book and opening its pages for the first time is one of life's Pleasures , at least for your average bookworm. But reading faces a lot of competition these days. Distractions , digital and otherwise , abound in our lives , and sometimes they make the act of reading feel outdated. But San Diego is home to dozens of local independent bookstores looking to push back on that sentiment. This Saturday , April 25th , marks Independent Bookstore Day coincides with the annual San Diego Book Crawl , which is back for its ninth year. KPBS arts and culture reporter Audie McAfee recently talked to some local indie booksellers about what books and independent bookstores have to offer us , even in our fast moving times. And Audie , welcome to roundtable. Great to have you.
S7: I'm very excited to be here.
S1: We're like , yeah , we're very excited to have you. So you looked into the local bookstore scene , you know , in the run up to this year's book crawl.
S7: And even just like reporting on it for the few weeks that I did. It's really great and it's flourishing and it is going to continue to do so. So yeah.
S1: And and you know , a lot of the bookstores you highlight here , I mean , they have a range of different specialties that they focus on. And you spoke with a lot of them. So what were some of the most common threads you heard from local bookshop owners.
S7: That they all love being bookshop owners , and that they all love working with each other ? There's just such a good relationship between all of them. They all really want each other to win , and they all really care about their customers , and they want them to come in and not feel judged and be able to find their new favorite books. So I think it's really great.
S1: Surrounding the conversation we're having right now. You know , here on this eve of of Independent Bookstore Day , you know , a much talked about study , I'd say released last year , found the time people are spending reading for pleasure has dropped pretty significantly over the last 20 years or so. I think it was like around 40% over the past couple of decades.
S7: But I do think that there is a lack of new readers coming into the scene , and that could always be better. But like the bookstores themselves didn't say , like , we have a lack of readers , like they seem to be doing pretty well with who's coming in.
S1: And , you know , as our maybe reading habits may have changed , also , how we often buy experience books has changed so much over the past couple of decades. Um , and this is something that , you know , you heard from , from the , the book owners you spoke with , obviously Amazon's like near the top. That's the first word that comes to mind for me. You know what are San Diego indie bookstores doing to compete with that kind of , you know , one click by have it at your door kind of experience.
S7: They're really trying to connect with the community and remind them that , like when you are buying books from independent bookstores , you're not just buying books , but you're investing back into the community , into your own community so that more events and more books and more just connectors can be made. Where you just go on Amazon , you click and buy and then that's it. And so you read the book , or you may not read the book , but there's no real conversation behind it and there's no real connection.
S1: And that brings up one of the bookstore owners that you spoke with. He mentioned this idea of brought up the idea of online algorithms , and how that's become such a central part of finding out about books and being recommended , but that they have a unique sort of advantage in that. Can you talk about what he told you there ? Yeah.
S7: Like if you think about it , books themselves bring you on a journey , but like it's starts before that. And so John Evans from Camino Books for the Road Ahead , he's the one who said that , quote , talking about how they are taking you on that journey. They're starting you off. They're like the little person who's like the doorkeeper before you go on this , like , big adventure and tells you what you're about to get into , um , and they can give you different recommendations , not just based off what you read before , but what maybe the employees are reading , or what can be exciting , or what they've heard , like whispers about. And it's not just about like the biggest and best thing.
S1: And you also spoke with one local author , um , Megan Drage Eccles. Uh , her book is called Sing the Night. And she actually had a really interesting insight into , I don't know what , how these independent bookstores can offer something unique to customers.
S8: The big corporations do not care. It doesn't make a difference whether you buy from them or not. But putting money back into the local community is so , so important. But also like you can't smell the internet.
S1: That's like such it like , I mean , it's just like such a perfect line. You can't smell the internet.
S7: She would bring me books home all the time. I was that kid who was in class and like , they were passing out the books that were ordered from the Scholastic Book Fair. And then I would just get the box because I ended up ordering the book. Yeah. Um , and there's just something so unique about , like , getting a fresh book that hasn't been all bent and like , you can smell that it , like , just came off the printer. Like , there's just something so special about that than , like , having your eyes glaze over as you scroll through , like Amazon and just pick something.
S1: So there's the the book buying piece here. But I mean , there was a much greater conversation here about what these stores bring to communities. And you highlight that. Tell us more about that piece.
S7: I think that overall , like there's always this conversation about third spaces , but what really is a third space ? And I think it's like , again , a place that you can go in , escape and like do something different than what is your regular everyday thing , like growing up as a socially awkward kid , that's like one of the best places you can go because you can like hide and not have to perform for anybody. And just like escape into this new world other than your own. And bookstores are a great place to learn , whether it's about other things , other people , or even just about yourself. Um , I loved like even at libraries , which are very similar , like just talking to the librarian or talking to the employees at the bookstore. Like , you learn so much about the bookstore and about how you can be a greater part of the community.
S1: I mean , what are some examples you mentioned ? You kind of put it there really well , like they provide us like a space to go and escape.
S7: Um , they , they just have little events that may not have anything to do with books. They could have paten sips , and it's just being in this , like , colorful space with all these different authors and all these different covers. And like , regardless if you're there for the books , you're going to end up becoming attracted to them.
S1: So there is an economic piece to this , I think , you know , you highlighted , you mentioned it earlier a little bit , but you bring up this idea in your story of how indie stores like these bookstores you highlight can have a multiplier effect , you know , here in our community. Tell us more about that.
S7: Um , mainly it's like , again , if you are buying books , then you're putting back into the bookstore and then the more the bookstore can put back into itself , then they can have more of these events. And so then they can tailor more things to kids or to older people. And just like all types of different communities , because so many bookstores serve so many different communities , and if you're not investing into that , then you're losing these hubs of learning , of connecting , of creating a new space for yourself. And without that , like , I feel like San Diego wouldn't have the same culture that it does now.
S1: So , you know , this leads up to this year's San Diego Book Crawl.
S7: As I've heard from pretty much everyone I talked to. Um , essentially , you would be hopping to each bookstore through the county. And you , the more bookstores you go to , the more prizes you get. I believe what was said was 4000 people started last year , and 400 actually went to every single one , and that's still a lot of people to hit every single bookstore. Um , there is always a chance for an enamel pin , as Megan had mentioned in the story. Um , and everyone loves an enamel pin. Um , and there's stickers and there's chances to connect with authors. There's going to be artists. And it's just like a really big , fun party full of life and fun.
S1: And with all that's going on with the event , I mean , this is also like a big financial piece for these bookstores.
S7: So it's a pretty big deal for them.
S1: So we've been talking about reading and how it's changed some of these concerning downward trends of just how people are reading today.
S7: Um , I think a lot of children just aren't being introduced to that realm of , like , enjoying reading and sitting down and reading. Like , so much stuff is connected to technology. And just go search this up and read it from there and like not holding something in your hands and like actually sitting with it and comprehending what they're holding , even if it's not a real story. Like , you still learn so much from that. There's so many lessons to be learned from books. So I just hope that in the future and through the book crawl that , like more kids , can be introduced to this world of reading and again , immersing yourself in a different world where you can really be whoever you want to be.
S1: The San Diego Book Crawl runs this Saturday , April 25th through Monday the 27th , and we'll have some links on our website and our show notes. I've been speaking with KPBS arts and culture reporter Audie McAfee. Audie , thanks so much for being here.
S7: Thank you. Please go to the book crawl.
S1: That'll do it for our show this week. Thanks so much for listening. And thanks to my guests this week as well. Also , a big shout out to the students from El Centro Central Union High School with us at the station today. They're behind the KPBS podcast , Voices Del Valle. You can find that wherever you listen to podcasts. You can also find the KPBS roundtable podcast. If you have any thoughts on today's show , you can always email us at roundtable at KPBS or leave us a message at (619) 452-0228. Roundtables. Technical producers Brandon Truffaut. The show was produced by Juliana Domingo. Brooke Rooth is roundtable senior producer. And I'm your host , Andrew Bracken. Have a great weekend.
