S1: Welcome in San Diego , it's Jade Hindman on today's show , a recent book challenges our perceptions of motherhood. Then our film critics dive deep into the minds of serial killers. Plus , we'll have your weekend preview. This is KPBS Midday Edition. Connecting our communities through conversation. All right , so what does it mean to be the perfect parent? Author Sonya murchison had her own ideas of what the ideal mom should be until she gave birth to her twin boys. Well , in her new book , The World's Worst Mom , Sona remembers and embraces the messiness of motherhood by taking us through her own journey , ups and downs included. You may know Sona as the co-host of the podcast Conan O'Brien Needs a Friend. This isn't the first time she's bestowed herself with the worst of title. Her last book , The World's Worst Assistant , looks at her 12 year journey being Canaan's executive assistant. Sona joins me now to talk about all things motherhood. Welcome to the show.
S2: Thank you Jade , thanks for having me. I'm really excited to be here. Thank you.
S1: So glad to have you here and to to be touching on this topic. This is good. Um , tell me , like , so what was your idea of the perfect parent? I mean , what did that look like?
S2: Oh , geez. I think from the get go it's being able to conceive properly. I mean , I had to go through IVF , so I start I started from the beginning. I was having trouble living up to the ideal I had set for myself. Um , so from there , from delivery , you know , I thought I was going to have a normal delivery , like a lot of people do , like I've seen in movies and film , I mean movies and TV a bunch of times. But I had a scheduled C-section , and then I thought I was going to be this mom who was just patient and understanding and very together. Keep a tidy house cook from scratch for every meal. But I lived up to none of that. None of that. I. I failed at every step of motherhood. You know , I really do feel like whatever ideal I had set for myself , I betrayed it completely.
S1: So it's such a common feeling.
S2: Yeah , right. What?
S1: What? I mean , how did that inspire you to write this book?
S2: Well , you know , when I would , um. You know , being a first time mother is filled with a lot of anxiety. And I remember just reading a lot of blog posts and a lot of books and a lot of things preparing myself. And even when I was in it , just sort of trying to get an idea of what to expect , of why things were happening a certain way. Why is one baby having such a hard time sleeping and the other one isn't? Why is that one better at eating and the other one isn't? So , Um , I , I felt like I read a lot of things that gave advice. Um , and I think that what I really needed sometimes was to just read a book where someone was talking about how hard it is , and it's okay that it's so hard. Um , and so I wanted to write the book that I wish I had been able to read when I was a mom , just this. Everything is not going to be perfect. You're not going to be perfect. And that's okay. You know , there's there's different definitions to motherhood , different approaches to motherhood. And and this is just mine. And I really hope that , you know , some people feel some sort of kinship with it , can relate to it , can enjoy it , maybe get a laugh out of it. That's really what I , I wrote it for. Right.
S1: Right. I mean , the , the television series , the movies , they really do a number on moms , right. And you kind of. Yeah. You when you become a mom , you have to shed those ideas. And sometimes it can be painful. Yeah.
S2: Yeah. It can. And it's not just that I think that the older generation sometimes just didn't want to talk about how hard things were. You know , I remember my mom would talk about how much of a hard time she had after she had my brother , and she said that the doctor said that she just had the baby blues. And , you know , now you realize she had postpartum depression. And it's , you know , it's not like she could have helped it in any way. But I think that there was just this , this , this sort of like sugar coating things that made things come be , try to sound a little more easier or try to sound a little more digestible or not make it seem so difficult. And I think now people are very open to hearing about real experiences , hearing about how hard it is , hearing about how much trouble it can be. Um , and , and I think it just normalizes it. I can't tell you how many people I've spoken to , how many moms I've spoken to. When you give them permission to open up , how they just let it all out. And I think it just makes them feel so much better to sort of commiserate with somebody else about how hard certain things can be about motherhood. Yeah.
S1: Yeah. You know , in the introduction of the book , you actually blame Conan O'Brien for why you're the world's worst mom. Tell me about that. Why? Why is that?
S2: So this the story was , you know , when I was introducing myself at a school event , I made a joke and I called my kids feral animals , and everybody laughed. And then I just sort of started making a lot of jokes at my kids expense. And I realized very quickly how making these jokes were kind of giving them license to act a certain way. You know , if you're calling someone crazy , they act crazy. So it's just I wasn't doing myself any favors. And the reason I blamed Conan and still blame Conan is because he put me in a job where I have to just keep up with him. And. And Matt Pauly , the other co-hosts of our podcast. All the time that I've gotten into this mindset where I just want to make people chuckle , I just want to make people laugh. So if it means making people laugh at my kid's expense , I will do that. And I learned very early on that I need to dial that back , and I need to stop constantly trying to make people laugh. I need to be less like Conan and more like myself. You know? I don't have the same sort of. I don't want to say neediness , but Jade , I think we both know it's meeting. It's when it's needed. I think that I don't have that neediness that he and a lot of other people have to make people laugh. So I became okay with just talking about my kids in a very normal way , without trying to get some laughs at.
S1: That darn Conan.
S2: Oh I know.
S1: Hey , you were Conan's executive assistant for 12 years , in case folks don't know , how did being his assistant prepare you for motherhood? Did it prepare you at all?
S2: It did. You know , when you're someone's assistant , you prioritize their comfort. You make sure that they have everything that they need when you go somewhere. So if he had an event to host , you know , I had to ask all the necessary questions like , who's going to be there? How many people are going to be there , what's expected of him? How long is he going to speak? Um , you know , if he , uh , if , you know , you have to make sure he has a change of clothes in case something spills on his pants or his shirt or something , and you have to make sure that he has coffee just to get his energy up , that he has a snack in case he's hungry , that the bathroom's nearby in case he needs shoes. And all of those things apply to motherhood. You know , whenever I go somewhere , I have to make sure I know where we're going and what we're doing. And if I have all the things that we need , you need to change the clothes in case they spill something on their pants or their shirt instead of coffee. Do they have milk? You know. Do they have water? Do they have the liquids they need? Where's the bathroom? Is it close by? So instead of prioritizing Conan and his needs , I was now prioritizing my kids and their needs and just making sure they had everything that they needed. So in a way , I like to joke that Conan was my practice baby. But I think because of how I mother , I think so much further in advance and the stakes are higher. So I obviously put way more of way more work into being a mom than I ever did as an executive assistant. And I think that he would have really loved this version of me because I think so much. I think in a , in a much more sort of complex way about where we're going and what we're going to do. And I think if I had some of the skills that I got now as a mother , I would have been a much better assistant.
S1: All right , all right.
S2: Well , yeah.
S1: I mean , listen , your journey to being the world's worst mom , um , though , did not start with Canaan. Um , it had to start somewhere. And that was , in your own words , being the world's worst daughter. How did your upbringing inform how you parent now?
S2: Um , you know , I looked a lot at , uh , how my parents handled certain situations. You know , they they didn't. I mean , I was an 80s kid. They didn't hover. There wasn't technology involved when I was growing up. They weren't googling every little thing. Um , you know , my mom , uh , didn't like to give us a lot of sugar. And back then , I was always so angry about that. But now I definitely understand what she was trying to do. Uh , so , yeah , I mean , I was a real challenge for my parents. I got hurt a lot. I was always , um , getting into trouble. I was always getting up to mischief. I was always getting lost. And , uh , now I realized I was essentially just sort of a wanderer. I was just someone who was very curious. And my parents really , I think , uh , they really tried to sort of , uh , nurture that curiosity in me. And I have always appreciated that. So I do that with my kids , you know , I , I know they're going to get hurt sometimes. Um , you know , we've lost them a couple times. Not anything that was serious , you know , but , uh , you know , you you turn around and they've just suddenly disappeared. So I think that I , uh , I take that with me when I , you know , I take those experiences as a child and into how I parent my kids. And I just make sure that , um , I don't try to take away that curiosity that I had to , in a way , with my kids. I try to harness that and I really try to nurture that , and I want them to stay curious forever.
S1: That's great. I mean , at the beginning of this interview , I asked you , what's your idea of a perfect parent? Um , but with all of that context that you just gave , what's your definition of of the worst , mom?
S2: Um , well , I mean , not to sound dark , but I don't think the worst mom has custody of her children.
S1: Well , sure , but. Yeah.
S2: Yeah. Yeah , but when.
S1: You include this genetic jinx parenting , if you will.
S2: Yeah , yeah.
S1: An older millennials and that that that freedom that you had as a child. And then you bring that into your parenting today. Um , and it's something that that is missing sometimes from , from a lot of parenting if you just didn't have that upbringing. Yeah.
S3: Yeah. I think that what what I've noticed.
S2: Is a lot of people are a lot more dependent on what they see online , which I think I did , too , for a really long time when I first had my boys. I , you know , you you really try to find certain answers. And so the easiest way to find answers is to go online. And it's such a detriment. I learned that very , very early on that it's a huge detriment to have too much information , if that makes sense. If you have way too much information and you Google everything and you try to find the answers to everything , it stops you from discovering it on your own. You know , I'm to really try to get to know your kids and try to understand them at a certain level. If you keep trying to look for the answers somewhere else. So I , I just had to get to a point where I had to tell myself to just stop doing that. I just couldn't keep looking for the answers somewhere else. And I , I really feel like I , I look back on how my kids were and they're just these little kids and , you know , they're they're born into a world they don't understand. You know , I'm in my 40s. I still don't understand a lot of it. I'm still learning things. So why would I expect a five year old to behave exactly the way he's supposed to behave? It's it's just it's silly to put expectations on your kids that really , you know , they could never , uh , live up to. It's just it's not fair to do that to them , you know? So that's there's a lot of things I've learned for sure about being a mom with my with my kids. Am I going to have more kids? No. Like , I'm not taking this knowledge and reapplying it to babies. I'm so done. But I'm done. But I think that , um , I think that when I meet new moms , one of my things is you need to stop googling the answer to the your questions and just try to figure out the answers on your own , with your own maternal instincts. You know , your maternal instincts are a lot better than anything Google can ever give you. Yeah.
S1: Yeah. Given that , I mean , how has being a parent changed you? You think?
S2: Um , wow. I think before I had kids , I was a very live in the moment kind of person. You know , I was a bit of a party girl. I enjoyed myself a lot. I , uh , you know , I was just. It was just me for a really long time , I was , I , I was sort of , um. I wasn't much of a relationship person , so most of my 20s and early 30s were spent just enjoying myself with my friends and just , you know , like , really , uh , working on those friendships that I had. So I have a lot of friendships that I love and a lot of friends that I care about a lot. Um , when my kids came around , I feel like I just became a version of myself that was a little bit more heightened. I mean , I think that I'm a lot more nervous now than I was before , because the stakes are so much higher with my boys. A lot of the decisions I make don't just impact me , they impact them. I'm a lot more guilty than I was before. I feel guilty every time I leave the house and they're home. I feel guilty anytime I enjoy myself when I'm away from them. You know , I feel guilty when I put them in camp for the summer. I just there's just so much that's changed about who I am fundamentally , that I sometimes it's hard to really track how much I've changed. But I , you know , being a mom now and having met my kids , I never want to go back to a world in which they don't exist. So I , you know , in a way , I think I've definitely changed for the better. I've really fully understand my capacity for love in a way. Yeah.
S1: Yeah. It's , you know , motherhood is is such a journey indeed. And you'll be making your journey to San Diego next week. Yeah. To celebrate the release of this book , what excites you about coming to San Diego? I know you actually met your husband here.
S2: I did , I met my husband at Comic-Con , and he likes to make a joke that he was dressed as Chewbacca. And so I'm just like , do you are you trying to tell people that I'm , like , attracted to Chewbacca? That I was just looking at a man in a Chewbacca costume and started talking to him , but I , um , I did. I met my husband. I love San Diego. San Diego has a very special place in my heart. Um , it's also a really great place to raise kids. There's so much to do in San Diego , you know , and we we go there a lot to have these , you know , weekend trips with our kids. But I'm going to the library shop in Mission Hills on September 5th , uh , for a daytime event at 11 a.m.. And it should be really fun. It's going to be a really fun time and I'm really excited about it.
S1: All right. Well , we look forward to it. I've been speaking with Sonia marchese , an author of the book. Sonia , sorry about that. Author of the book The World. I'm putting letters in there imagining things. Author of the book The World's Worst Mom. Sona will be at the library shop in Mission Hills on Saturday , September 5th. The event starts at 11 a.m. and of course , we'll include more details on our website , KPBS. Org Sona , thank you so very much , I appreciate you.
S2: Are we done already? I had a really good time talking to you. Thank you so much for having me. Likewise.
S1: Likewise. Likewise. All right. Still to come , our film critics dive deep into the minds of serial killers with their mid-day movie picks for this month. KPBS Midday Edition returns after the break. Welcome back to KPBS midday Edition. I'm Jade Hindman. Today is the birthday of infamous murderer and grave robber Ed Gein , also known as the Butcher of Plainfield. And while we're not celebrating his birth , we are using it as a jumping off point for our midday movies discussion on serial killers in films and streaming series. Joining me once again are KPBS , Cinema Junkie , Beth Accomando and movie Wallace podcaster Yazdi. Welcome to you both.
S4: Thank you so much. Thank you.
S1: Okay , y'all. So , Beth , give us a little background on how we define what a serial killer is. Sure.
S4: Sure. So using the FBI definition , it's an individual who murders three or more people. With the killings taking place over a period of more than one month in three or more separate events. So someone who murders multiple people in a short space of time is referred to as a spree killer , or somebody who murders a large number of people all at once , would be a mass murderer. So that's kind of the differentiation through what the FBI says. And the term serial killer comes up in Germany back in 1930 and in the US as early as 1960. But it really entered kind of the pop culture zeitgeist and , you know , media attention and public consciousness. After FBI Special Agent Robert Ressler popularized it in 1974. Essentially , serial killers have existed all through time , long before this term came up. Most notably , there was someone Gilles de la in 15th century France , of course , famously Elizabeth Bathory in 16th century Hungary , who was supposed to have bathed in the blood of virgins. Jack the Ripper in the 19th century in England , who was never caught , And in the U.S. , the first sort of recognized serial killer was H.H. Holmes in the 19th century. But they just weren't labeled serial killers at that time.
S1: We have you to thank and blame for this topic of terrible people. So why did you want to discuss serial killers? What's wrong with you , Beth?
S5: I am so fascinated. With.
S4: With. Them.
S5: Them.
S4: So when I was a little kid , my dad had a 26 volume crime encyclopedia that was behind his desk , and I used to sit there and read those things cover to cover , because I felt like if I could look at the darkest part of humanity , the scariest thing that there is out there and try to understand it , maybe that could be helpful. Maybe I could learn to avoid it or combat it in a better way. So that is something that has always sort of been , I feel like always been in my DNA. In fact , this year , this 12 hour horror marathon I do , Secret Morgue is themed to serial killers and slashers. So all this has been on my mind for the past few months. And since we started by talking about Ed Gein , technically he's not a serial killer because he was only convicted of killing two people. But the thing that kind of grabbed everyone's attention and made him such a like , horrific image for a lot of people is he robbed graves and then ended up making , like , furniture out of human remains and a suit and I think gloves and a mask out of human flesh. And this was in the late 1950s in a small town. So , you know , we're a little jaded now , but imagine how shocking that would have been , like in the late 1950s and just as the murders were coming to light. Author Robert Bloch , who lived a mere 35 miles away from Ed Gein , was finishing his book psycho , about a serial killer. Now , Bloch has denied that Gein's case had any influence on his character of Norman Bates. But once Alfred Hitchcock turned the book into a film in 1960. People couldn't help seeing a connection between the fictional serial killer and the real one , especially in terms of the unnaturally close relationship between the men and their mothers. So the film does a good job of depicting a certain kind of serial killer personality. It falters a little bit at the very end , where it tries to give a very clinical explanation of Norman's mental state. But here , in this early scene between Anthony Perkins as Norman Bates and Martin Balsam as a private investigator , we see this character who is kind of a beta male , someone who's a loser , someone who's been dominated by his mother , but he's trying to act like he's a lot smarter and more in control than he actually is. So here's a scene from psycho from 1960.
S6: Does anyone at home know who is somebody sitting up in the window? No , no , no there isn't. Oh , sure. Go ahead , take a look. Oh , that. That must be my mother. She's. She's an invalid. It's practically like living alone. Ah , I see. Well , now , if this , uh , girl , Marion Crane were here , you wouldn't be hiding her , would you? No , not if she paid you well. No. Let's just say for the years , just for the sake of argument , that she wanted you to gallantly protect her , you'd know that you were being used , that you wouldn't be made a fool of , would you? But I'm not a fool. Well , and I'm not capable of being fooled , and I'm not even by a woman. Well , this is not a slur on your manhood. Let's put it this way. She might have fooled me , but she didn't fool my mother. Well , then your mother met her , could I? Can I talk to you , mother? No. As I told you , she's. She's confined. Yes. We're just for a few minutes , that's all. It might be some hint that you missed out on. You know , sick old women are usually pretty sharp. Can I just. Mr.. Mr. Arbogast , I wouldn't disturb. I think I've. I think I've talked to you all I want to. Yes , but I think it'd be much better if you left now. Thanks.
S4: Anthony Perkins is great in this. So. Ed Gein is also the inspiration for Leatherface in the Texas Chainsaw Massacre films , as well as the Buffalo Bill character in silence of the lambs.
S1: Well , Yazdi , that brings us to one of the serial killer films you appreciate , which is silence of the lambs. Quite the film there.
S7: Yes , yes. Silence of the lambs has the unique distinction of being the first , and actually the only horror film to date to win the best film Oscar. And like Mindhunter , which we'll be talking about in just a second , most of the film is a procedural to track down the fictional serial killer Buffalo Bill , who was inspired by Gein and Ted Bundy. And of course , Jodie Foster very famously plays the rookie FBI officer who becomes kind of obsessed in her pursuit of Buffalo Bill , and she seeks out this very enigmatic serial killer , Hannibal Lecter , played indelibly by Anthony Hopkins. Hannibal Lecter is in captivity , and she wants to understand the person she's trying to capture through tapping into the mind of Hannibal Lecter. And here is one of the famous scenes between them.
S8: I'm only asking you to look at this , doctor. Either you will or you won't. Yeah.
S9: Jack Crawford must be very busy indeed. If he is recruiting help from the student body. Busy hunting that no one , Buffalo Bill. What a naughty boy he is. Do you know why he's called Buffalo Bill? Please tell me. The newspapers won't say.
S8: Well , it started as a bad joke in Kansas City homicide. And they said this one likes to skin his humps.
S9: Why do you think he removes their skins? Agent Starling , throw me with your acumen.
S8: It excites him. Most serial killers keep some sort of trophies from their victims.
S9: I didn't. Know.
S8: Know. Oh , you ate yours.
S7: The film , of course , is canon. Now for a hundred things it does , right. The expert editing , the use of layered storytelling. The emotional undertow that drives the lead and the villain in Hopkins remains unmatched. But I think there is one thing about the film that is not celebrated enough , in my opinion , and that is the direction of the late Jonathan Demme.
S1: Beth , you were talking about how you kind of put yourself in the position of someone who might have been targeted by a serial killer. What would you do? I mean , I think that's a natural reaction. I'd do the same thing. Also , the sort of dissecting the mind of a serial killer and what what went wrong there? What? What is there thinking? That's also something that makes these movies , I think , so fascinating. You , Beth , have another film that features the fictional serial killer Hannibal Lecter.
S4: Yes , I do. So back in 1986 , which was five years before silence of the lambs , Michael Mann adapted another Thomas Harris book. This one was Red Dragon , and it features Hannibal Lecter again , and this time played in a much less flamboyant but equally chilling style by Brian Cox. And this film was called Manhunter , and again an FBI agent , this time played by William Petersen. And he wants to pick the brain of imprisoned serial killer Hannibal Lecter , this time to catch another serial killer who is dubbed the Tooth Fairy. And here's a scene between the FBI agent and Lecter.
S6: I want you to help me , Doctor Lecter. Yes.
S10: I thought so.
S6: It's about Atlanta and Birmingham. Yes. You read about it.
S10: In the papers. I don't tear out the articles. I wouldn't want them to think I was dwelling on anything. What they did there. You want to know how he's choosing them , don't you?
S6: I thought you might have some ideas. Why should I tell you? You get to see the file in this case. And there's another reason.
S10: Pray tell.
S6: I thought you might be curious to see if you're smarter than the person I'm looking for.
S10: Then , by implication , you think you're smarter than me. Since you quote me. No.
S6: I know that I'm not smarter than you.
S10: Then how did you catch me?
S6: You had disadvantages. What disadvantages? You're insane.
S10: Don't think you can persuade me with appeals to my intellectual vanity.
S6: I don't think I'll persuade you at all. You'll either do it or you won't. Besides , we have Doctor Bloom working on it. He's the best.
S10: Do you have the file with you? Yes. Pitch us. Yes. Let me have them. And I might consider it. No.
S6: No.
S10: Let me have the file and I'll tell you what I think.
S4: So this is another great procedural crime thriller. And its tooth fairy character is very loosely inspired by a real killer , the BTK killer. And that's an acronym for bind , torture , kill. And his name was Dennis Rader. So , yes , once again , we have a real life serial killer inspiring a fictional one. Wow.
S1: Wow. And he was one of multiple serial killers featured in a series that you both ranked very high. And that is David Fincher's Mindhunter. Yazdi , why do you like this show?
S7: Yeah , it's for the exact reason that you mentioned earlier , which is trying to get into the mind of the serial killers in an attempt to better maybe prevent them from doing more harm. So Mindhunter consists of two seasons , which were produced by David Fincher , and Fincher himself directed several of the episodes in both seasons. So the show is about the formation and work of the Behavioral Science Unit , or the BSU , the real life department at the FBI , which was formed to better understand serial killers so we can do better at catching them. And in doing so , the show becomes a very thoughtful , systematic dive into almost every known serial killer that became a household name since the early 1970s. Many have called the show cold and methodical. Yes , it is both of those things , but I think only to its great credit. And in Mindhunter we seldom see much violence depicted on screen , and as a filmmaker , it would have been so much easier to give in to the sensationalism and have us actually see re-enactments of the worst kind of crimes. Instead , the show relies on meticulously recreated interviews conducted with actual serial killers , and to see what they have to say about what they did and to hear it in their own words is far more disquieting. The kind that settles into your bones with a chill. And Mindhunter knows that what you can imagine in your head is far more disturbing than anything you're actually shown on screen. I also wanted to say that Mindhunter , in a way , is the logical extension of the film Zodiac that Fincher had directed a decade ago. That film , too , was about the tedious , tireless process that goes into trying to nab a serial killer , and it asks the question , can we truly understand the mind of the smartest serial killer? Or does evil simply exist as is , with no explanation. Mindhunter is full of careful reenactments of FBI interviews , but it is also an exercise in masterful character development for each of the three principal cast members , played by Jonathan Groff , Anna Torv , and Holt McElhinney.
S1: Beth , what do you love about the show? What does it get right?
S4: Yeah , I mean , I agree with a lot of what Yazdi said. This show is amazing and David Fincher is so good at this kind of storytelling , and it tries to be very accurate. And like there's the current Ryan Murphy monster , the Ed Gein story , which goes into exactly what Yazdi said Fincher avoids , which is the sensationalizing of the case and the facts. So Fincher and his team pull a lot of the dialogue from actual interviews the FBI had with these serial killers. And what I love is that so much of the show is just those interviews. You're just in a room with a serial killer and these FBI agents. It's objectively a safe space. It's a prison. There are guards. There shouldn't be anything that causes them to feel danger. Yet these are some of the most chilling moments ever created on film or in a show. And the casting of the serial killers is all spot on. They look and sound like the real people that they're portraying. And as Yahtzee mentioned , Fincher did this in Zodiac. And again , Zodiac is inspired by the real Zodiac Killer , which also inspired the dirty Harry film. And in that film , also the most tense scenes are just dialogue and like the threat feels so palpable. So here's one of the many stunning interview scenes with serial killer Ed Kemper , who was known as the Coed Killer. And these scenes just send chills up my spine.
S11: It's not easy butchering people's hard work physically and mentally. I don't think people realize you need to vent. What are you writing down?
S6: Oh , I just think it's an interesting choice of words. Vocation?
S11: Well , what would you call it? A hobby? I'd say it's more than that. Look at the consequences. The stakes are very high.
S4: And the show is based on Mindhunter inside the FBI's Elite Serial Crime Unit , which was written by John Douglas and Mark Shaker. And the book tells the true story of FBI agents John Douglas and Robert Ressler , along with an Burgess who was the inspiration for the Anna Torv character. And there's an excellent documentary on her called Mastermind to Think Like a Killer , and I highly recommend that. Burgess was a psychiatric clinical nurse , and she pioneered assessing and treating trauma in rape victims , and her work with victims really helped profiling these serial killers.
S1: We kind of touched on this a little earlier , but why do you think we have this fascination , if you will , with serial killers? Why are so many films and series and documentaries focused on them? Yazdi.
S7: I don't know , I'm not one of those. Don't.
S5: Don't. Don't include me in the way I hear you guys. I'm with you.
S7: No , but I think at some level I understand this fascination of trying to understand the very absolute worst that humanity is capable of. And there has to be an inherent fascination with that.
S1: Beth , what about it?
S4: I agree. It's wanting to know the darkest parts of humanity. Can I learn anything from these films? Does it help me to understand what prompts these people to do these things , or what could help me if I ever encountered any of them? You know , I would never say to a serial killer , you don't have to do this. I think we've learned by now they have no conscience. It doesn't do you any good. It only plays into what they want you to be , which is a victim , and to have power over you. I did speak to a forensic psychologist who for 24 years was a consultant to the Behavioral Analysis Unit of the FBI , and he worked with the people who inspired Mindhunter. And here's what Jay Reid Malloy says about why we might be fascinated with these movies and these serial killers.
S12: People flock to the theater to in a safe place to experience the fear of being prey to a predator. It can capture you emotionally , to where you can experience that fear and explore that fear within yourself. In the context of a safe environment. The experience of being prey to a predator is so primitive. This level of fear is buried deep in what's called the limbic system of our brain. That fear has kept us safe to be able to sense predation and be able to then do 1 or 3 things typically hide , fight , or flee. And then one emerges out of the theater or leaves the couch. And having had this. The experience of deep limbic arousal of fear , I think , is a is an enormous draw.
S1: And that is very , very fascinating. I've been speaking with our midday movie critics , KPBS , Cinema Junkie , Beth Accomando and movie Wallace podcaster Yasi Padova. Beth Yazdi , thank you so much.
S4: Thank you for putting up with my request to do serial killers.
S1: I'm sold on the films now I am.
S7: Thank you. Jane.
S1: Stick with us here. About high desert folk music and more in your weekend preview when KPBS Midday Edition returns. Welcome back. You're listening to KPBS Midday Edition. I'm Jade Hindman for our weekend preview. We have some high desert folk music , free Latinx musicals and theater and art that really takes a critical look at a beloved children's book. Joining me with all the details is KPBS arts reporter and host of the finest podcast , Julia Dixon Evans. Julia , welcome.
S13: Hey , Jade. Thanks for having me.
S1: Glad to have you here. So let's start with an art exhibit. It's being described as an ante tribute to a children's book , Shel Silverstein's The Giving Tree. Yeah.
S13: Yeah. So this is at Art Produce in North Park , and it's a collaboration with space for Art , curated by Jill Dorsey , who's also the senior curator at the Museum of Contemporary Art , San Diego. And , you know , the exhibit's called The Giving Tree. It's art kind of about nature in a way that she sees as an anti tribute to the book , which is like super beloved by a lot of people. And she said that she first got the idea for the exhibit after a strange interaction on a dating app , of all places. Um , yeah , about the book. So she decided then to reread it. When.
S2: When.
S14: We go back to The Giving Tree and read it. You know , there is a boy who visits a tree. His first action. When I went back to read it , I was just so struck by the fact that his first action is to gather her leaves into a crown and become king. And then , you know , over time , he visits her , he gets older and he , you know , there is no limit on the demands he makes of her.
S13: And Darcy told me that this book is just seen as like a parable of parental , specifically maternal , unconditional love. The tree revels in , in like her sacrifice. And this doesn't change as the boy gets older either. And another thing she realized is that it's also a parable for our relationship with nature. And this is kind of what really calcified what this exhibit could be for her.
S14: The staying power of the book is rooted in this myth of maternal self-sacrifice and that this is , you know , the ultimate fulfillment. And it reinforces this idea that the natural world and women's bodies , for that matter , are just there for the taking. Right. This is just this is just there for us.
S13: So she pulled a bunch of local artists together who do a lot of work exploring ecosystems , exploring nature , and a lot of them specifically working with trees like artist Ruth Wallen , for example , who spent years in this like photography , collage practice , taking pictures of trees , especially burned or down trees , and kind of observing the regeneration and the renewal. There's also work by Andrea Chung. Jeanie. Dunn. Melanie Taylor. Scott B Davis. Tons more. And everything in this exhibit will be for sale with the prices on the labels. I love that. So if you're interested in buying local art or starting to think about making a collection , this is a low stakes way to to step in the door. The reception is Saturday from 5 to 8 and the exhibit will be up through September 26th. This is the art produce in North Park , but after the opening reception , viewings are by appointment.
S1: Ah that's excellent. All right. Sticking with visual art for one more. There's a new exhibit at the downtown Library's art gallery. What can you tell us about becoming heirlooms?
S13: Yeah , I just went to see this , and it's really interesting and really thoughtful. Like , I could have spent a lot more time there with each piece. Um , first of all , I love this gallery so much. The downtown library is such incredible architecture in the first place , and then the galleries all the way up on the ninth floor , like within the dome. Um , and the exhibit's called Becoming Heirlooms. It's curated by Craft Desserts , Carry on Quick and Adam John Manley. It's also part of Craft in America's Handwork 2026 series. So this is a collection of pretty conceptual pieces. They're all sculptures of some sort that are looking at like the significance and the hope , but also the burden of what it means to inherit something. Um , there's glass pieces suspended from the ceiling. There's a giant Ruth Bader Ginsburg necklace spilling onto the floor. There's this hope chest with the words don't embarrass. The family burned into the lid and thinking about , like , the idea of unwanted heirlooms. One of my favorite pieces is Diana Benavidez. It's called relax , Hold Your Breath , Don't Move , which is about mammograms and how breast cancer can be passed down as well. And it's like this three piece sculpture of paper breasts smushed between these hand-made bricks and the whole exhibit is so interesting. It's on view already through November 7th , and there'll be an artist reception later on in September , but the gallery is open Tuesday through Saturday.
S1: The handmade bricks.
S5: Oh , boy.
S1: Okay , you have one more free recommendation. The carnival of new Latinx Musicals. What do you know about this project?
S13: Yeah , this is a collaboration between La Jolla Playhouse , two youth theatre , UC San Diego's Department of Theatre and Dance , and the Latinx Theater Commons. It's basically like a new play reading series , but for musicals. So they call them concert readings. So from Friday through Sunday , they're going to have four brand new musicals , all celebrating the voices of the Latinx community. There's Jesse Sanchez's Suenos , our American musical on Friday. That's at 630. And this is about a young musician who's brought up in an agricultural town who has her heart set on going to Juilliard on Saturday afternoon at 130. There's a historical piece about two immigrant communities in 1918 Florida. Saturday Night at Seven is a musical about LGBTQ plus women and their relationships with their mothers. And then at 130 on Sunday , there's going to be this folklore inspired story about two sisters going on an epic journey. And these are all at the outdoor Epstein Family Amphitheater XD which is great because there's tons of space. I just double checked and there are tickets still available to all of them. Free tickets. You just have to RSVP. But note that this is outdoor , not a ton of shade , so keep that in mind if you're going to the afternoon shows.
S1: All right. Finally , before we go , let's hear what's going on in live music this weekend.
S13: So as always , there's a lot. But one show on my radar is Jesus Gonzalez. He is a local folk and electronic artists. His voice is just so powerful , mesmerizing. He's he's kind of been this , like , longstanding fixture in local music as well. We're listening to a performance he did where he arranged his music for chamber orchestra with Art of Allen. Um , I was in the audience for the show , and I still think about this concert all the time. This is a song. I am just a mountain.
S15: In you. Know. Fly.
S13: And on Saturday , he's gonna perform solo at the Hakuba Hot Springs Hotel. There. Old bathhouse venue. It's like this open roof , high desert ruins building. Like from the 1920s. It's handled it. It's under the stars. And the show starts at 830 on Saturday. It's all ages and a suggested donation. 20 bucks. It is kind of a drive. It's just over an hour from downtown , so you could always make a night of it and grab dinner , drinks at the restaurant , or splurge on one of their rooms or their casitas.
S1: Sounds like a lovely time. It really does. And this is easy , easy listening right here. I like it. All right. You can find details on these and more arts events on our website at KPBS. I've been speaking with KPBS arts reporter and host of the finest podcast , Julia Dixon Evans. Julia , thank you so much.
S13: Thank you. Jade. This is fun.
S1: That's our show for today. I'm your host , Jade Hindman. Thanks for tuning in to Midday Edition. Be sure to have a great day on purpose , everyone.
