S1: Welcome in San Diego , it's Jade Hindman on today's show , as America's two 50th approaches , we're talking about indigenous history. This is KPBS Midday Edition connecting our communities through conversation. So this summer , the United States is celebrating America 250. I mean , two and a half centuries since the signing of the Declaration of Independence. But the story of America's birthday. The story we learn in our history books excludes a whole lot of people. And that includes indigenous people who inhabited this land long before the U.S. was even a concept. So today , we are talking about the real history of America's founding and the importance of telling it. I'm joined now by a great panel of guests , Stanley Rodriguez , who's a member of the Santa Isabel Band of the Epi Nation. He's chair of Kumeyaay studies at Cuyamaca College and past president of Kumeyaay Community College. Ethan Venegas is a member of the Barona Band of Mission Indians and professor of American Indian Studies at San Diego State University , and and Tara Smith is a member of the Torres Martinez Desert Cahuilla tribe in Coachella Valley. She's director of news from Native California magazine and director of Berkeley Roadhouse A roundhouse , Rather , which is a program that publishes native literature. Welcome to you all.
S2: Thank you.
S3: Thank you for having me. Thank you. Hey.
S1: Hey. So glad to have you all here for this conversation. Uh , Ethan , I'm going to start with you. You know , when you think about this idea of America 250 and what it signifies , what comes to mind for you?
S2: Um , one of the main things when I'm teaching the American Revolution is that , the seeds of the revolution actually started with the Royal Proclamation of 1763. So essentially , when the French and Indian War ended , there was a line that limited expansion beyond the Illini Mountains and in fact , George Washington and many folks who desired this Indian land essentially started the revolution at that point. And the Stamp Act and the things that came later also were a part of the American Revolution. But in fact , the royal proclamation was in fact the very seed of the revolution , because these folks could no longer expand past this line at the Royal Proclamation line. Interesting.
S1: Interesting. Um , Stan , what are your thoughts?
S4: Well , you know , our people here in San Diego , we've really endured full waves of encroachment. The Spanish , the Mexican , uh , Russian encroachment with fur trappers and then the American invasion. And , you know , it all started with the papal bulls and the doctrine of discovery. And the reason I'm bringing this up , even though it was , uh , uh , put out in the late 1490s that , um , the United States still uses the doctrine of discovery is one of the founding documents for the creation of the United States. And in that it said , go forth to all nations that are not inhabited by white Christian nations. Those lands can be seized and the people can be enslaved , and they continue doing that. So as they continued with westward expansion , they did not see us natives as human beings , but as something to get rid of And we'll talk more about those policies of extermination that happened here in California later on.
S1: All right , Tanya , what do you think?
S5: Well , something that somebody had reminded me of really recently. I've been doing a couple of these interviews for the 250th anniversary of , quote , unquote , independence of the United States. And somebody it was an actual it was another California native who was a reporter who was doing a story with USA today had reminded me that in 1776 , the region known as California wasn't even a state yet. It was. So we weren't even part we weren't part of of of the incorporation of of independence. During that time , we were dealing with a whole other set of problems in 1776 , which I believe , correct me if I'm wrong , was during was in the beginning years of the mission period here in , in Southern California. Um , and so , yeah , that's what I really give some thought to. It's like , okay , so we weren't part of the United States yet , but we were in one of the waves of encroachment that Doctor Rodriguez talked about just a bit ago.
S1: Ethan , you were shaking your head. Yeah.
S2: Yeah. So one of the things that we have to recognize as these revolutionary seeds were being sown in 1763 , the Stamp Act in 1765. You know , in 1769 , we have the very first colonization efforts of the Spanish with Father Sarah and Pedro Farias established right here. Essentially , this is the origin story of California in San Diego. And so we have a very different but equally interesting story here that very , very few people actually know about and appreciate. And so the East Coast gets gets all the love , all the attention , and the West Coast gets very little. And I would even say that , you know , I think most people would agree California Indian history is the most , the least understood history of all American history. And so that's why I was grateful to do this , this segment today , to shed light on that.
S1: Yeah , we're going to dive more into it. But , um , Tara , you grew up in on the Torres Martinez Desert Cahuilla Indian Reservation in Thermal , California. What story did you learn about the creation of America growing up?
S5: Luckily for me , my dad was a counterculture historian , so I remember one of the first projects we did when I was a kid. Oh , gosh , I must have been like in the second or third grade we worked on. It was pretty hardcore. My dad , I mean , we didn't have the vernacular at this time , but basically my dad and I were studying how the smallpox epidemic was biological warfare. And so I unlike a lot of people that I ended up going to college with , had a very , very early understanding of the the genocide that had happened to native people , um , across the the Western hemisphere. So , um , yeah , it wasn't a shock to me as it was to a lot of people. Um , I've always had a lot of understanding and , um , and my and , you know , empathy in my heart for the ancestors and everything that they went through. Um , but I do know a lot of people throughout my life who have been just stunned at , um , upon learning what's happened here. Um , especially in California.
S1: You know , Stanley , the Declaration of Independence also promoted racist stereotypes of indigenous people through blatant wording. Uh , that , of course , I don't need to repeat. And earlier you mentioned the doctrine of discovery , which really gave , um , you know , religious cover to the violent and the oppressive policies against indigenous people and really around the globe. What were those policies and how was that language used to justify them?
S4: Well , these policies that were created , I mean , it gave a huge blessing for , uh , European Christian nations to , you know , to go forth. The first one in the 1450s gave , uh , Portugal the , um , the , the license to go into Africa and just basically loot and enslave the people. And the same thing happened in the Americas with the Spanish with in the 1490s , with the doctrine of discovery. And you see that happening? Uh , you know , they talk about how Christopher Columbus was this great man. I mean , he was coming to , you know , uh , just , uh , exploit resources and take away , you know , from people. And , you know , I used to hear it growing up that this is the new world and this was discovered , and , you know , the thing is this. We've been here since time immemorial. How can you discover a place that people are already living at? You know , I mean , there's contradictions to that. But , you know , the narrative that has been created , it , it you know it. It glorifies it. You know , this European , you know , first venturing out into this , you know , untamed world and , you know , bringing civilization and completely discount what was here and the impact that took place with the native people of these lands.
S1: And , Ethan , I want to go back to something you said a little bit earlier , which is that , you know , California is where this all began. And that challenges the idea of , you know , Western expansion even and , you know , gateway to the West , all of that. Um , talk a bit about that , though. Yeah.
S2: Yeah. I mean , one of the things Stan taught me is that when California became a state. 80% of the population were indigenous California Indians. And you hardly ever hear that narrative when California became a state. You know , just the American experience came here after the Mexican War ended in 1848. You have the Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo , and then California would become a state two years later. And so California became a state , the fastest , um , ever to become a state from a territory. And to do that , it had to do something with the Native Americans. And when you hear about territories becoming states , one of the criteria is what do we do with the Native Americans? And the answer was removal and reservations. And , you know , our guests hinted to the California genocide. That was also an option. And so really , the American experience when it came here , um , really , you know , it was actually the only official state sponsored genocide in the Union. That was from 1846 to 1872 , when approximately 50 to 100,000 Native Americans were killed and paid for in bounties. Mhm.
S1: Mhm. And I want to make sure that that that's clear. White settlers ventured out west in the 1840s in search of gold , and in the years that followed , killed around 80% of California's indigenous population in a state sanctioned genocide. Um , that legacy obviously still goes on. And it wasn't until 2019 that California officially apologized for that genocide. So , Stanley , what is is the legacy of that today , you think?
S4: Well , I'm glad you. I'm glad you brought that up. I'm glad you brought that up because , I mean , it was institutionalized policy. I mean , from the first governor , Governor Peter Burnett , who stated in his inauguration that the war of extermination between the Indian and the white men will continue until all Indians are exterminated. This was his words , and those policies continued and continued. Um , you know , um , it was illegal for , for , for natives to , um , uh , testify against white people. White people have not been prosecuted for killing an Indian. As a matter of fact , they even got paid a bounty for it. Um. Uh , I mean , whole nations were eradicated. I mean , their language and culture , their name. They've just been wiped off the face of the earth. That the whole native epistemology was having science that they've had for thousands upon thousands of years has been erased. And these are some of the things that have happened. California a lot of people don't realize has more language and cultural diversity than any other place in the world. Aside from Papua New Guinea. Hundreds and hundreds of different nations resided here. Well , you know , with the genocide that took place , a lot of those nations were were wiped out. And , um , the ones who are left , you know , a lot of people never even knew that there were native people here. A lot of people don't realize that San Diego has more reservations than any other county in the country. We have 18 reservations here , you know , but , uh , because our numbers have been depleted due to diseases , wars , things like that. Um , they they hardly hear from us. And one last thing I just wanted to say , you know , we were talking about the war of extermination , but we also had a resistance. We had a pushback such as the Ghetto Uprising , the Antonio Glover Uprising that took place in 1851.
S1: And as soon as we come back from our break , that is where I want to pick our conversation up. Stick with us , KPBS. Midday edition is back right after the break. Welcome back to KPBS midday Edition. I'm Jade Hindman. The United States is preparing to celebrate 250 years since the signing of the Declaration of Independence. But although indigenous people are a central part of America's origin story , they are often left out of the narrative. I'm here with three guests to talk about the history and the importance of centering indigenous perspectives as we talk about America. 250. I'm here with Stanley Rodriguez , member of Santa Isabel Band of the Epi Nation. Ethan Venegas is a member of the Barona Band of Mission Indians , and Tanya Smith is a member of the Torres Martinez Desert Cahuilla tribe in Coachella Valley. Um , first , I want to pick up where we left off , Ethan , which is a thread on resistance and resilience. Um , pick us back up there. Yeah.
S2: Yeah. I think if you look at the context of what happened here in California , it was essentially an apocalypse , you know , and one of the things that the main reason why we are still here is because of our resistance and our resilience. And for example , my tribe started with just 38 people. There's founding 38 founding members of Barona. Many tribes started with very few people. And it's it's really a miracle we are still even here. And resistance started. In fact , the very first year Father Sarah became landed here in 1769. His caravan was shot. Literally. Father Sarah's servant boy died , died in his arms , an arrow shot through his neck. We also have the resistance , the great resistance movement. In 1775 , a year before the Independence Day , where the mission was burned down and about 12 teepee villages organized and burned down the mission. This is one of the most successful mission revolts in mission history , as well as there was one in Yuma or Quezon. And so we have this long history of resistance all throughout the mission period , as well as in the American period. One of the great resistance movements my father was a part of was the occupation of Alcatraz for 18 months , where they demonstrated to the government to that they must be honor their treaties. And this was the Treaty of Fort Laramie. But there were 400 plus treaties that were broken. And so it is up to us Native Americans to remind the government to oblige by their treaties and their promises and resistance takes many forms. You know , we're educators. All of us are educators as a form of resistance. Um , you know , when our comic book , we have a whole page on resistance , uh , highlighting the different moments and movements when Kumeyaay people were there resisting the government. And this indeed , in fact , one of the greatest things we can do is build resilience , because , you know , life is hard and it will always be this way. So we must resist and be resilient if we are to survive. Yeah.
S1: Yeah. And you just slid that in there that you have a comic book? Uh , we're gonna we're going to mention that we'll have details to that on our website , PBS.org. Because it does it tells a real story of California history there. Um , Daria , what does the survival of indigenous communities in the face of systemic erasure teach us about resilience?
S5: Gosh , that's a complicated question , but I , I look to , uh , those of us , you know , here in Southern California who are part of the birdsong world , the bird song and dance world , and to see , um , the these songs that have been with us since our creation and how I mean , there are thousands of singers and dancers from all over the region and the persistence and it's an illustration to me , of the persistence and the strength that we have as , as , as native people , indigenous people , first people of Californians , original Californians. Um , and , uh , I think that there's a lot to be taught about that , that you don't give up that. Um , we come from the strongest stock that there is. You know , I mean , lots of people have perished , and and we're still here , and , um , and that's , um , that's something definitely to be to be looked at for sure. Yeah.
S1: Yeah. Hey , Stanley , you know , this week on the show , um , we've been talking about recent immigration related rulings by the Supreme Court and what they say about who gets to be American. I mean , it makes you think about America's history of forced displacement from the genocide of indigenous people in California to the transatlantic slave trade. And it's a reminder that while some have have been forced to cross borders , others have had borders crossed them. When you think about the state of immigration today and how it fits into American history , what comes up for you?
S4: I have strong feelings about that. Um , when the international border was created , it cut right through Kumeyaay territory. Half of our nation is on this side of the border. The other half is in Baja , and there's 4 to 6 Kumeyaay communities still in Baja. So passing and passing has been an issue for us. And when I go to Tijuana and to another , I'm in Kumeyaay territory. I'm in the territory of my people. On the flip side , when somebody come onto this side , they're still in the same , uh , territory. But because of the two governments , um , they've had trouble , uh , crossing and recrossing. And the way the administration has run is becoming even more difficult to do that. And , you know , we we travel across , uh , to support each other for ceremonies such as waves , other other things that are going on. Uh , celebrations , other different things. And it is an important part of , uh , keeping , keeping the cohesion with our people. So , um , when they had , when the , the border War was put up , um , you know , when , you know , you were talking earlier about resistance , there was calls to action. And to me , I , from both sides of the border went to the to the border wall and protested what was going on. And , you know , it was a show that , you know , other people have lost many , you know , due to , uh , the things that have happened in the past. We are still here and we are still a voice , and we're still a people to be dealt with. So that's one of the things that , you know , I just want to say about that.
S1: And , Theresa , do you have anything you'd like to add quickly?
S5: You know , I did really quickly. Um , about the it was mentioned earlier about , um , you know , about , uh , what's happened here in California as being a genocide. And I know that there was an apology some , some time back. I'm hoping that there's some teeth behind that apology because , um , to support everything that we lost , that we're trying to regain. Our language programs need support. Ah , the environmental impacts that have been , you know , that have , um , ravaged our communities. We need support for restoration. And I hope that that in , in , in people coming to to terms and reconciliation will will put some teeth behind their apologies and , and make sure that that those things are , um , are met for us. Indeed.
S1: Indeed. Ethan. Yeah.
S2: Yeah. I just want to to dovetail off that when I do , I do often speak to many different groups all around the county , you know , young , old , different demographics. The one of the main questions , the very first question I ask is how many people have heard of the California genocide? And because I want to take stock and who actually knows about this? And almost always it's less than 5% of the room , sometimes zero. And so the problem is , is there wasn't any coverage on this and including the apology. And so , you know , and that's one of the things is how do we get this into the mainstream? That's always been my biggest question is people need more awareness of this story and this history so it doesn't repeat itself.
S1: And that's that gets to the crux of why this is so important , why you all as educators are so important. Correct? Correct. Yeah. Absolutely.
S2: Absolutely. Yes.
S4: Yes.
S1: Well , for those who who do want to learn more , all three of you have plenty of great work highlighting indigenous history and perspectives. And we're going to link that to our website , KPBS. I've been speaking with Stanley Rodriguez , member of Santa Isabel Band of the Epi Nation. He's chair of Kumeyaay studies at Cuyamaca College and past president of Kumeyaay Community College. Also Ethan Venegas , member of the Barona Band of Mission Indians and professor of American Indian Studies at San Diego State University. And also Tara Smith , a member of the Torres Martinez Desert Cahuilla tribe in Coachella Valley. She's editor of news from Native California magazine and director of Berkeley Road Roundhouse , a program that publishes native literature. Thank you all so much for this conversation and for joining us.
S2: Thank you.
S3: Thank you. Thank you.
S1: All right. That's our show for today. I'm your host , Jade Hindman. Thanks for tuning in to Midday Edition. Be sure to have a great day on purpose , everyone.
